Everything I don't know about guns

[cletus1]

Regardless Cuzz when Obama said The United States is the only advanced country where this type of mass violence occurs do you think that is true?

So you want me to disregard facts and go with a gut feeling? OK.

I don't know if we are the "only advanced country" but we're no doubt right up in the lead. You'd have to define the question better for me to give a better answer. I'm kind'a literal by nature that way.

 The whole premise of what Obama and most others are saying is that we have a problem that other country's don't.

OH wait, lets throw in the disclaimer and change that comment to "with this kind of frequency."


But wait.......  "But, even if one puts it in terms of frequency, the president’s statement is still false, with the US ranking 9th compared to European countries."


I just need to know what is the answer according to Obama?

Obama..... “We know that other countries, in response to one mass shooting, have been able to craft laws that almost eliminate mass shootings,” the president said. “Friends of ours, allies of ours — Great Britain, Australia, countries like ours. So we know there are ways to prevent it.”


 
 



In  Britain Members of the public may own sporting rifles and shotguns, subject to licensing, but handguns were effectively banned.  in 1996.

And Australia had a massive mandated gun confiscations.

Its OBVIOUS what Obama wants.

 

I share your frustration on the subject of gun control. I grew up with guns and in a hunting family. I don't want to see them banned completely as in some other countries. I mean that.

What I hear from a lot of gun owners when it comes to trying to find solutions to this issue in particular is... nothing. I can only assume they believe this is the price we have to pay and we should get used to it. My belief is gun owners themselves and their organizations need to get into the conversation and come up with something they can live with. If they don't they are going to eventually get run over and a solution is going to be imposed upon them regardless.

I don't have a good answer but I don't think the only solution is to take all the guns away. That's just the easiest answer not the best. The answer likely involves some shooter safety requirements, maybe licensing (just maybe, don't shoot me), mental health program improvements... I don't know. It's not a one subject fix that's for sure.

My point is if the people most affected don't stand up and contribute ideas they aren't going to like the results. I think I can safely guarantee that.

edit to add; I forgot to ask y'all, what do you have to suggest?

You said, "The solution". I'm positive there isn't one short of getting rid of every single gun. So there isn't one.

What you mentioned " some shooter safety requirements" I don't see how that helps anything other than accidenst.



"maybe licensing (just maybe, don't shoot me ," I'm pretty sure several if not most of our mass shooters could have gotten a license.


 ""mental health program improvements..."" sure, better methods to find and expose people who are whacked. But that doesn't mean we would know until it's too late.

Something can be done, but it won't. America is gun crazy. The idea of gun buyback programs or voluntary turn ins won't work here. There is a big difference between the US and Australia. I posted only part of the article. Click the link to read it all.


This is what happened when Australia introduced tight gun controls


By Laura Smith-Spark, CNN

Updated 12:35 PM ET, Fri June 19, 2015





What happened in Australia? Gun violence was bad. A decade of gun massacres had seen more than 100 people shot dead. The last straw was an incident at a popular tourist spot at Port Arthur, Tasmania, in April 1996, when a lone gunman killed 20 people with his first 29 bullets, all in the space of 90 seconds. This "pathetic social misfit," to quote the judge in the case, achieved his final toll of 35 people dead and 18 seriously wounded by firing a military-style semiautomatic rifle.


What happened next? Only 12 days after the shootings, in John Howard's first major act of leadership and by far the most popular in his first year as Prime Minister, his government announced nationwide gun law reform.

Uniform legislation agreed to by all states and territories -- the national government has no control over gun ownership or use -- specifically addressed mass shootings: Rapid-fire rifles and shotguns were banned, gun owner licensing was tightened and remaining firearms were registered to uniform national standards.


How did Australia do it? In two nationwide, federally funded gun buybacks, plus large-scale voluntary surrenders and state gun amnesties both before and after Port Arthur, Australia collected and destroyed more than a million firearms, perhaps a third of the national stock, according to Professor Philip Alpers of the University of Sydney, who is editor of gunpolicy.org. No other nation had attempted anything on this scale. The national government also banned the importation of new automatic and semiautomatic weapons. And the buyback was paid for by a special one-off tax on all Australians.


What was the political fallout? It wasn't without cost to John Howard. Political interest groups among his conservative base raised hell, and the move met strong resistance from some in rural areas. His party's coalition partner in those areas suffered in subsequent elections. But the majority of Australians, shocked by the mass killing, backed action. And it worked. Multiple homicides involving gun are exceptionally rare, none have been remotely as bloody and random as the Port Arthur massacre, and none have involved the sort of weapons whose importation was banned.


What exactly happened to murder and mass killing?
In the years after the Port Arthur massacre, the risk of dying by gunshot in Australia fell by more than 50% -- and stayed there. A 2012 study by Andrew Leigh of Australian National University and Christine Neill of Wilfrid Laurier University also found the buyback led to a drop in firearm suicide rates of almost 80% in the following decade.


In the 19 years since the announcement of legislation specifically designed to reduce gun massacres, Australia has seen no mass shootings. As Howard wrote in an opinion piece for the New York Times in 2013, "Today, there is a wide consensus that our 1996 reforms not only reduced the gun-related homicide rate, but also the suicide rate."


Can America follow it? The gun culture in the United States is a powerful factor that can't be ignored. Howard acknowledged those key differences in an interview with CNN's Christiane Amanpour in 2013. "I don't come here with any lectures," he said. Australia started with a much lower gun death rate, he said, and "we don't have constitutional guarantees in relation to these things."
"However," he added, "that doesn't alter the fact that our murder rate using guns has fallen and there's not much doubt in my mind that it's the availability of guns that causes such a high rate of murder using weapons." 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/19/world/us-a...n-control/

[Willie Krash]

Hold on for a minute. I got it, I really do. Let's encourage black men in the cities to open carry. I bet we find a way to restrict access to guns pretty damn quick. Waddaya think? Remember when the Black Panthers started caring guns and Saint Ronald Reagan inacted some serious gun control. 

And Raygun opened up the mental clinics, can't afford that stuff. Once dismantled hard to put back together. War is more fun.
There are black open carry "clubs" btw. 

[cletus1]

Hold on for a minute. I got it, I really do. Let's encourage black men in the cities to open carry. I bet we find a way to restrict access to guns pretty damn quick. Waddaya think? Remember when the Black Panthers started caring guns and Saint Ronald Reagan inacted some serious gun control. 

And Raygun opened up the mental clinics, can't afford that stuff. Once dismantled hard to put back together. War is more fun.
There are black open carry "clubs" btw. 

Black open carry clubs you say? I will take your word for it. 

[Willie Krash]

Look up the Huey P Newton gun club.

As to why this is more prevalent today as opposed to the good old days, could it have anything to do with the SCOTUS librealizing gun laws 7 or 8 years back?

[cletus1]

How Mass Shooters Get Their Guns


Here are the origins of every gun used in the high-profile massacres of Obama’s presidency.
By Christina Cauterucci and Greta Weber


it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country.

Photo illustration by Juliana Jiménez. Photos by Andrew Burton/Getty Images and Joern Pollex/Getty Images.

On Thursday, after Chris Harper Mercer shot and killed 9 people at Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon, President Obama gave the latest in a tragic series of addresses in response to mass shootings in the U.S. "It cannot be this easy for somebody who wants to inflict harm to get his or her hands on a gun," he said.
But it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country. Of the 11 shootings that prompted Obama to give a public address, eight were committed by gunmen who’d bought at least some of their firearms legally, some just days before their massacres. Several had histories of criminal behavior and mental illness that fell just shy of prohibiting their gun purchases—and in one case, a bureaucratic slip-up in the routine FBI background check was at fault. Here’s how the guns in each attack came into the hands of t.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: Nov. 5, 2009
Perpetrator: Nidal Hasan
Guns: FN Five-seven semiautomatic pistol and Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. He killed 13 people and injured more than 30.
How he got them: Guns Galore, a gun shop in Killeen, Texas, sold Hasan the gun legally three months before the shooting. He was not required to register the firearm on the base, because he didn’t reside there.
.



Shooting: Gabrielle Giffords constituent meeting in aTucson, Arizona, parking lot
Date: Jan. 8, 2011
Perpetrator: Jared Lee Loughner
Gun: Glock 19 9 mm semiautomatic handgun. Loughner killed six people and shot 13 more, including Rep. Giffords.
How he got it: Arizona, which has some of the laxest gun laws in the country, passed a law in 2010 that allowed people to buy guns for concealed carry without a permit. Though guns cannot be sold to people with severe mental illness and though Loughner was suspended from his community college for mental health issues, no court had ever declared him mentally unfit, so his on-the-spot background check at a gun outlet came up clear.



Shooting: Movie theater in Aurora, Colorado
Date: July 20, 2012
Perpetrator: James E. Holmes
Guns: Holmes used a semiautomatic Smith & Wesson M&P15 (a variation on the military’s M16 weapons), a 12-gauge Remington 870 shotgun, and a semiautomatic .40-caliber Glock 22, killing 12 and injuring 70. TheNew York Times reports that these three guns are some of the most popular in the U.S.—so widely used, in fact, that a “three-gun competition” has been established to test gun enthusiasts’ proficiency on each in a target-shooting game of speed.
How he got them: All three guns were purchased legally in 2012 between May 22 and July 6 at three different Colorado gun stores.




Shooting: Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin
Date: Aug. 5, 2012
Perpetrator: Wade Michael Page
Gun: Like Holmes and Loughner, Page used a semiautomatic handgun. His was a Springfield 9 mm. Page killed six and injured four before killing himself.
How he got it: Page purchased the gun legally in a Milwaukee-area store. At the time of the shooting, the Brady Campaign on Gun Violence had named Wisconsin among the 10 states with the fewest gun restrictions..



Shooting: Sandy Hook Elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut
Date: Dec. 14, 2012
Perpetrator: Adam Lanza
Guns: First, Lanza shot and killed his mother with a .22-caliber Savage MK II-F bolt action rifle. At the school, Lanza used an AR-15 semiautomatic, like Holmes. Lanza killed 26 people in total and injured two before killing himself.
How he got them: Both guns belonged to Lanza’s mother.
.



Shooting: Washington Navy Yard in Washington, D.C.
Date: Sept. 16, 2013
Perpetrator: Aaron Alexis
Gun: Alexis began the attack with a Remington 870 12-gauge shotgun (he also took a 9 mm pistol from a police officer at the scene after shooting him). He killed 12 people and injured eight before killing himself.
How he got it: Two days before the massacre, Alexis bought his shotgun at a store in Northern Virginia that claims to be the “only gun shop inside the Beltway.” He initially inquired about buying a handgun, but because he was from out of state, the store would have had to ship it to a dealer in his home state. That’s when he went for the shotgun. Though he’d been arrested in 2004 after shooting out the tires of another man’s car and in 2010 after shooting his gun (accidentally, he said) through his ceiling into the apartment of his upstairs neighbor, neither charge was enough to sully his Virginia background check.
.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: April 2, 2014
Perpetrator: Ivan Lopez
Gun: .45-caliber Smith & Wesson M&P pistol. He killed three and injured 14 before killing himself.
How he got it: Lopez purchased his gun legally at the same Killeen, Texas, store that sold Hasan the gun he used in the first Fort Hood shooting. Because Lopez didn’t live on the base, he was not required to register his wea.



Shooting: Jewish community center in Overland Park, Kansas
Date: April 13, 2014
Suspect: Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.
Guns: Remington Model 870 shotgun and a handgun. Frazier allegedly killed three people.
How he got them: John Mark Reidle of Missouri allegedly bought the shotgun at a Missouri Walmart four days before the massacre, because Miller’s former felony conviction prohibited him from owning a gun. The handgun is of unknown prove.



Shooting: Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South Carolina
Date: June 18, 2015
Suspect: Dylann Roof
Gun: .45-caliber Glock. Roof killed nine people and injured one.
How he got it: A flaw in the FBI’s background check system allowed Roof to buy the handgun at a South Carolina store eight days after his 21st birthday. When the gun dealer asked the FBI for approval to sell the gun to Roof, the bureau noted that he’d recently been arrested and exercised its three-day investigation period to get more information. Two days later, an FBI agent found that Roof had not been convicted of the felony drug possession charge, so an immediate denial was not merited. She tried to contact the appropriate police department for more information, but because of a jurisdictional issue the agent couldn’t get the police report in time to make the three-day deadline. Had she gotten the report, she would have seen that Roof had admitted to drug possession, which would have kept him from obtaining the weapon.
.



Shooting: Two military centers in Chattanooga, Tennessee
Date: July 16, 2015
Perpetrator: Mohammad Youssuf Abdulazeez
Guns: According to law enforcement, when police killed Abdulazeez, he was in possession of a 12-gauge shotgun, a 9 mm handgun, and an assault weapon along the lines of an AK-47. He killed five people and injured two.
How he got them: A friend of Abdulazeez’s said the gunman had bought four firearms from an online arms sale site, which allowed him to skirt a background check, but the claim has not been confirmed. At least some of the guns were obtained legally.




Shooting: Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon
Date: Oct. 1, 2015
Perpetrator: Chris Harper Mercer
Guns: Harper Mercer brought six guns with him on his shooting spree—five handguns and a rifle—and owned eight others, including pistols, four other rifles, and a shotgun. He killed nine people and injured seven before he was killed by police.
How he got them: All were purchased legally.

[cletus1]

Look up the Huey P Newton gun club.

As to why this is more prevalent today as opposed to the good old days, could it have anything to do with the SCOTUS librealizing gun laws 7 or 8 years back?

I did.   

The Republican Second Amendment defenders probably love this. 

[tvguy]

So you want me to disregard facts and go with a gut feeling? OK.

I don't know if we are the "only advanced country" but we're no doubt right up in the lead. You'd have to define the question better for me to give a better answer. I'm kind'a literal by nature that way.

 The whole premise of what Obama and most others are saying is that we have a problem that other country's don't.

OH wait, lets throw in the disclaimer and change that comment to "with this kind of frequency."


But wait.......  "But, even if one puts it in terms of frequency, the president’s statement is still false, with the US ranking 9th compared to European countries."


I just need to know what is the answer according to Obama?

Obama..... “We know that other countries, in response to one mass shooting, have been able to craft laws that almost eliminate mass shootings,” the president said. “Friends of ours, allies of ours — Great Britain, Australia, countries like ours. So we know there are ways to prevent it.”


 
 



In  Britain Members of the public may own sporting rifles and shotguns, subject to licensing, but handguns were effectively banned.  in 1996.

And Australia had a massive mandated gun confiscations.

Its OBVIOUS what Obama wants.

 

I share your frustration on the subject of gun control. I grew up with guns and in a hunting family. I don't want to see them banned completely as in some other countries. I mean that.

What I hear from a lot of gun owners when it comes to trying to find solutions to this issue in particular is... nothing. I can only assume they believe this is the price we have to pay and we should get used to it. My belief is gun owners themselves and their organizations need to get into the conversation and come up with something they can live with. If they don't they are going to eventually get run over and a solution is going to be imposed upon them regardless.

I don't have a good answer but I don't think the only solution is to take all the guns away. That's just the easiest answer not the best. The answer likely involves some shooter safety requirements, maybe licensing (just maybe, don't shoot me), mental health program improvements... I don't know. It's not a one subject fix that's for sure.

My point is if the people most affected don't stand up and contribute ideas they aren't going to like the results. I think I can safely guarantee that.

edit to add; I forgot to ask y'all, what do you have to suggest?

You said, "The solution". I'm positive there isn't one short of getting rid of every single gun. So there isn't one.

What you mentioned " some shooter safety requirements" I don't see how that helps anything other than accidenst.



"maybe licensing (just maybe, don't shoot me ," I'm pretty sure several if not most of our mass shooters could have gotten a license.


 ""mental health program improvements..."" sure, better methods to find and expose people who are whacked. But that doesn't mean we would know until it's too late.

Something can be done, but it won't. America is gun crazy. The idea of gun buyback programs or voluntary turn ins won't work here. There is a big difference between the US and Australia. I posted only part of the article. Click the link to read it all.


This is what happened when Australia introduced tight gun controls


By Laura Smith-Spark, CNN

Updated 12:35 PM ET, Fri June 19, 2015





What happened in Australia? Gun violence was bad. A decade of gun massacres had seen more than 100 people shot dead. The last straw was an incident at a popular tourist spot at Port Arthur, Tasmania, in April 1996, when a lone gunman killed 20 people with his first 29 bullets, all in the space of 90 seconds. This "pathetic social misfit," to quote the judge in the case, achieved his final toll of 35 people dead and 18 seriously wounded by firing a military-style semiautomatic rifle.


What happened next? Only 12 days after the shootings, in John Howard's first major act of leadership and by far the most popular in his first year as Prime Minister, his government announced nationwide gun law reform.

Uniform legislation agreed to by all states and territories -- the national government has no control over gun ownership or use -- specifically addressed mass shootings: Rapid-fire rifles and shotguns were banned, gun owner licensing was tightened and remaining firearms were registered to uniform national standards.


How did Australia do it? In two nationwide, federally funded gun buybacks, plus large-scale voluntary surrenders and state gun amnesties both before and after Port Arthur, Australia collected and destroyed more than a million firearms, perhaps a third of the national stock, according to Professor Philip Alpers of the University of Sydney, who is editor of gunpolicy.org. No other nation had attempted anything on this scale. The national government also banned the importation of new automatic and semiautomatic weapons. And the buyback was paid for by a special one-off tax on all Australians.


What was the political fallout? It wasn't without cost to John Howard. Political interest groups among his conservative base raised hell, and the move met strong resistance from some in rural areas. His party's coalition partner in those areas suffered in subsequent elections. But the majority of Australians, shocked by the mass killing, backed action. And it worked. Multiple homicides involving gun are exceptionally rare, none have been remotely as bloody and random as the Port Arthur massacre, and none have involved the sort of weapons whose importation was banned.


What exactly happened to murder and mass killing?
In the years after the Port Arthur massacre, the risk of dying by gunshot in Australia fell by more than 50% -- and stayed there. A 2012 study by Andrew Leigh of Australian National University and Christine Neill of Wilfrid Laurier University also found the buyback led to a drop in firearm suicide rates of almost 80% in the following decade.


In the 19 years since the announcement of legislation specifically designed to reduce gun massacres, Australia has seen no mass shootings. As Howard wrote in an opinion piece for the New York Times in 2013, "Today, there is a wide consensus that our 1996 reforms not only reduced the gun-related homicide rate, but also the suicide rate."


Can America follow it? The gun culture in the United States is a powerful factor that can't be ignored. Howard acknowledged those key differences in an interview with CNN's Christiane Amanpour in 2013. "I don't come here with any lectures," he said. Australia started with a much lower gun death rate, he said, and "we don't have constitutional guarantees in relation to these things."
"However," he added, "that doesn't alter the fact that our murder rate using guns has fallen and there's not much doubt in my mind that it's the availability of guns that causes such a high rate of murder using weapons." 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/19/world/us-a...n-control/

Yeah I've read all that.

[tvguy]

How Mass Shooters Get Their Guns


Here are the origins of every gun used in the high-profile massacres of Obama’s presidency.
By Christina Cauterucci and Greta Weber


it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country.

Photo illustration by Juliana Jiménez. Photos by Andrew Burton/Getty Images and Joern Pollex/Getty Images.

On Thursday, after Chris Harper Mercer shot and killed 9 people at Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon, President Obama gave the latest in a tragic series of addresses in response to mass shootings in the U.S. "It cannot be this easy for somebody who wants to inflict harm to get his or her hands on a gun," he said.
But it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country. Of the 11 shootings that prompted Obama to give a public address, eight were committed by gunmen who’d bought at least some of their firearms legally, some just days before their massacres. Several had histories of criminal behavior and mental illness that fell just shy of prohibiting their gun purchases—and in one case, a bureaucratic slip-up in the routine FBI background check was at fault. Here’s how the guns in each attack came into the hands of t.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: Nov. 5, 2009
Perpetrator: Nidal Hasan
Guns: FN Five-seven semiautomatic pistol and Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. He killed 13 people and injured more than 30.
How he got them: Guns Galore, a gun shop in Killeen, Texas, sold Hasan the gun legally three months before the shooting. He was not required to register the firearm on the base, because he didn’t reside there.
.



Shooting: Gabrielle Giffords constituent meeting in aTucson, Arizona, parking lot
Date: Jan. 8, 2011
Perpetrator: Jared Lee Loughner
Gun: Glock 19 9 mm semiautomatic handgun. Loughner killed six people and shot 13 more, including Rep. Giffords.
How he got it: Arizona, which has some of the laxest gun laws in the country, passed a law in 2010 that allowed people to buy guns for concealed carry without a permit. Though guns cannot be sold to people with severe mental illness and though Loughner was suspended from his community college for mental health issues, no court had ever declared him mentally unfit, so his on-the-spot background check at a gun outlet came up clear.



Shooting: Movie theater in Aurora, Colorado
Date: July 20, 2012
Perpetrator: James E. Holmes
Guns: Holmes used a semiautomatic Smith & Wesson M&P15 (a variation on the military’s M16 weapons), a 12-gauge Remington 870 shotgun, and a semiautomatic .40-caliber Glock 22, killing 12 and injuring 70. TheNew York Times reports that these three guns are some of the most popular in the U.S.—so widely used, in fact, that a “three-gun competition” has been established to test gun enthusiasts’ proficiency on each in a target-shooting game of speed.
How he got them: All three guns were purchased legally in 2012 between May 22 and July 6 at three different Colorado gun stores.




Shooting: Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin
Date: Aug. 5, 2012
Perpetrator: Wade Michael Page
Gun: Like Holmes and Loughner, Page used a semiautomatic handgun. His was a Springfield 9 mm. Page killed six and injured four before killing himself.
How he got it: Page purchased the gun legally in a Milwaukee-area store. At the time of the shooting, the Brady Campaign on Gun Violence had named Wisconsin among the 10 states with the fewest gun restrictions..



Shooting: Sandy Hook Elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut
Date: Dec. 14, 2012
Perpetrator: Adam Lanza
Guns: First, Lanza shot and killed his mother with a .22-caliber Savage MK II-F bolt action rifle. At the school, Lanza used an AR-15 semiautomatic, like Holmes. Lanza killed 26 people in total and injured two before killing himself.
How he got them: Both guns belonged to Lanza’s mother.
.



Shooting: Washington Navy Yard in Washington, D.C.
Date: Sept. 16, 2013
Perpetrator: Aaron Alexis
Gun: Alexis began the attack with a Remington 870 12-gauge shotgun (he also took a 9 mm pistol from a police officer at the scene after shooting him). He killed 12 people and injured eight before killing himself.
How he got it: Two days before the massacre, Alexis bought his shotgun at a store in Northern Virginia that claims to be the “only gun shop inside the Beltway.” He initially inquired about buying a handgun, but because he was from out of state, the store would have had to ship it to a dealer in his home state. That’s when he went for the shotgun. Though he’d been arrested in 2004 after shooting out the tires of another man’s car and in 2010 after shooting his gun (accidentally, he said) through his ceiling into the apartment of his upstairs neighbor, neither charge was enough to sully his Virginia background check.
.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: April 2, 2014
Perpetrator: Ivan Lopez
Gun: .45-caliber Smith & Wesson M&P pistol. He killed three and injured 14 before killing himself.
How he got it: Lopez purchased his gun legally at the same Killeen, Texas, store that sold Hasan the gun he used in the first Fort Hood shooting. Because Lopez didn’t live on the base, he was not required to register his wea.



Shooting: Jewish community center in Overland Park, Kansas
Date: April 13, 2014
Suspect: Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.
Guns: Remington Model 870 shotgun and a handgun. Frazier allegedly killed three people.
How he got them: John Mark Reidle of Missouri allegedly bought the shotgun at a Missouri Walmart four days before the massacre, because Miller’s former felony conviction prohibited him from owning a gun. The handgun is of unknown prove.



Shooting: Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South Carolina
Date: June 18, 2015
Suspect: Dylann Roof
Gun: .45-caliber Glock. Roof killed nine people and injured one.
How he got it: A flaw in the FBI’s background check system allowed Roof to buy the handgun at a South Carolina store eight days after his 21st birthday. When the gun dealer asked the FBI for approval to sell the gun to Roof, the bureau noted that he’d recently been arrested and exercised its three-day investigation period to get more information. Two days later, an FBI agent found that Roof had not been convicted of the felony drug possession charge, so an immediate denial was not merited. She tried to contact the appropriate police department for more information, but because of a jurisdictional issue the agent couldn’t get the police report in time to make the three-day deadline. Had she gotten the report, she would have seen that Roof had admitted to drug possession, which would have kept him from obtaining the weapon.
.



Shooting: Two military centers in Chattanooga, Tennessee
Date: July 16, 2015
Perpetrator: Mohammad Youssuf Abdulazeez
Guns: According to law enforcement, when police killed Abdulazeez, he was in possession of a 12-gauge shotgun, a 9 mm handgun, and an assault weapon along the lines of an AK-47. He killed five people and injured two.
How he got them: A friend of Abdulazeez’s said the gunman had bought four firearms from an online arms sale site, which allowed him to skirt a background check, but the claim has not been confirmed. At least some of the guns were obtained legally.




Shooting: Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon
Date: Oct. 1, 2015
Perpetrator: Chris Harper Mercer
Guns: Harper Mercer brought six guns with him on his shooting spree—five handguns and a rifle—and owned eight others, including pistols, four other rifles, and a shotgun. He killed nine people and injured seven before he was killed by police.
How he got them: All were purchased legally.

I didn't look at them all but I looked at several and they all purchased their guns legally. So what's your point?

[cletus1]

How Mass Shooters Get Their Guns


Here are the origins of every gun used in the high-profile massacres of Obama’s presidency.
By Christina Cauterucci and Greta Weber


it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country.

Photo illustration by Juliana Jiménez. Photos by Andrew Burton/Getty Images and Joern Pollex/Getty Images.

On Thursday, after Chris Harper Mercer shot and killed 9 people at Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon, President Obama gave the latest in a tragic series of addresses in response to mass shootings in the U.S. "It cannot be this easy for somebody who wants to inflict harm to get his or her hands on a gun," he said.
But it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country. Of the 11 shootings that prompted Obama to give a public address, eight were committed by gunmen who’d bought at least some of their firearms legally, some just days before their massacres. Several had histories of criminal behavior and mental illness that fell just shy of prohibiting their gun purchases—and in one case, a bureaucratic slip-up in the routine FBI background check was at fault. Here’s how the guns in each attack came into the hands of t.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: Nov. 5, 2009
Perpetrator: Nidal Hasan
Guns: FN Five-seven semiautomatic pistol and Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. He killed 13 people and injured more than 30.
How he got them: Guns Galore, a gun shop in Killeen, Texas, sold Hasan the gun legally three months before the shooting. He was not required to register the firearm on the base, because he didn’t reside there.
.



Shooting: Gabrielle Giffords constituent meeting in aTucson, Arizona, parking lot
Date: Jan. 8, 2011
Perpetrator: Jared Lee Loughner
Gun: Glock 19 9 mm semiautomatic handgun. Loughner killed six people and shot 13 more, including Rep. Giffords.
How he got it: Arizona, which has some of the laxest gun laws in the country, passed a law in 2010 that allowed people to buy guns for concealed carry without a permit. Though guns cannot be sold to people with severe mental illness and though Loughner was suspended from his community college for mental health issues, no court had ever declared him mentally unfit, so his on-the-spot background check at a gun outlet came up clear.



Shooting: Movie theater in Aurora, Colorado
Date: July 20, 2012
Perpetrator: James E. Holmes
Guns: Holmes used a semiautomatic Smith & Wesson M&P15 (a variation on the military’s M16 weapons), a 12-gauge Remington 870 shotgun, and a semiautomatic .40-caliber Glock 22, killing 12 and injuring 70. TheNew York Times reports that these three guns are some of the most popular in the U.S.—so widely used, in fact, that a “three-gun competition” has been established to test gun enthusiasts’ proficiency on each in a target-shooting game of speed.
How he got them: All three guns were purchased legally in 2012 between May 22 and July 6 at three different Colorado gun stores.




Shooting: Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin
Date: Aug. 5, 2012
Perpetrator: Wade Michael Page
Gun: Like Holmes and Loughner, Page used a semiautomatic handgun. His was a Springfield 9 mm. Page killed six and injured four before killing himself.
How he got it: Page purchased the gun legally in a Milwaukee-area store. At the time of the shooting, the Brady Campaign on Gun Violence had named Wisconsin among the 10 states with the fewest gun restrictions..



Shooting: Sandy Hook Elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut
Date: Dec. 14, 2012
Perpetrator: Adam Lanza
Guns: First, Lanza shot and killed his mother with a .22-caliber Savage MK II-F bolt action rifle. At the school, Lanza used an AR-15 semiautomatic, like Holmes. Lanza killed 26 people in total and injured two before killing himself.
How he got them: Both guns belonged to Lanza’s mother.
.



Shooting: Washington Navy Yard in Washington, D.C.
Date: Sept. 16, 2013
Perpetrator: Aaron Alexis
Gun: Alexis began the attack with a Remington 870 12-gauge shotgun (he also took a 9 mm pistol from a police officer at the scene after shooting him). He killed 12 people and injured eight before killing himself.
How he got it: Two days before the massacre, Alexis bought his shotgun at a store in Northern Virginia that claims to be the “only gun shop inside the Beltway.” He initially inquired about buying a handgun, but because he was from out of state, the store would have had to ship it to a dealer in his home state. That’s when he went for the shotgun. Though he’d been arrested in 2004 after shooting out the tires of another man’s car and in 2010 after shooting his gun (accidentally, he said) through his ceiling into the apartment of his upstairs neighbor, neither charge was enough to sully his Virginia background check.
.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: April 2, 2014
Perpetrator: Ivan Lopez
Gun: .45-caliber Smith & Wesson M&P pistol. He killed three and injured 14 before killing himself.
How he got it: Lopez purchased his gun legally at the same Killeen, Texas, store that sold Hasan the gun he used in the first Fort Hood shooting. Because Lopez didn’t live on the base, he was not required to register his wea.



Shooting: Jewish community center in Overland Park, Kansas
Date: April 13, 2014
Suspect: Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.
Guns: Remington Model 870 shotgun and a handgun. Frazier allegedly killed three people.
How he got them: John Mark Reidle of Missouri allegedly bought the shotgun at a Missouri Walmart four days before the massacre, because Miller’s former felony conviction prohibited him from owning a gun. The handgun is of unknown prove.



Shooting: Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South Carolina
Date: June 18, 2015
Suspect: Dylann Roof
Gun: .45-caliber Glock. Roof killed nine people and injured one.
How he got it: A flaw in the FBI’s background check system allowed Roof to buy the handgun at a South Carolina store eight days after his 21st birthday. When the gun dealer asked the FBI for approval to sell the gun to Roof, the bureau noted that he’d recently been arrested and exercised its three-day investigation period to get more information. Two days later, an FBI agent found that Roof had not been convicted of the felony drug possession charge, so an immediate denial was not merited. She tried to contact the appropriate police department for more information, but because of a jurisdictional issue the agent couldn’t get the police report in time to make the three-day deadline. Had she gotten the report, she would have seen that Roof had admitted to drug possession, which would have kept him from obtaining the weapon.
.



Shooting: Two military centers in Chattanooga, Tennessee
Date: July 16, 2015
Perpetrator: Mohammad Youssuf Abdulazeez
Guns: According to law enforcement, when police killed Abdulazeez, he was in possession of a 12-gauge shotgun, a 9 mm handgun, and an assault weapon along the lines of an AK-47. He killed five people and injured two.
How he got them: A friend of Abdulazeez’s said the gunman had bought four firearms from an online arms sale site, which allowed him to skirt a background check, but the claim has not been confirmed. At least some of the guns were obtained legally.




Shooting: Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon
Date: Oct. 1, 2015
Perpetrator: Chris Harper Mercer
Guns: Harper Mercer brought six guns with him on his shooting spree—five handguns and a rifle—and owned eight others, including pistols, four other rifles, and a shotgun. He killed nine people and injured seven before he was killed by police.
How he got them: All were purchased legally.

I didn't look at them all but I looked at several and they all purchased their guns legally. So what's your point?

Access to guns is to damn easy. What's your point, Obama saying so?

[Hugo]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

[Cuzz]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

Short and sweet.....

No present nor future mass shooters are allowed to purchase any long guns nor short guns. Hugo neither.

[Wonky3]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

And there you have it.

No single law, or pages and pages of legislation is going to solve this problem. 

We have a SOCIAL problem, more and more people feeling isolated, disenfranchised, alienated, and otherwise bitter and angry about things that even they may not be able to explain. 

Look at our history here at the RVF and note all the "Fuck you's" and hateful dialog that has become all to common. Our society lacks the "civil discourse" once mostly observed by a more tolerate population. More and more people find themselves at the margins as the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. Our institutions that we once admired and depended on are crumbling and new attitudes are replacing them that are not yet embraced by the population as a whole. 

Hugo is right. Change won't happen with new laws. Change won't be legislated from "on high". Change will come when individuals, then families, communities, and regions understand the value of rational and critical thinking, observing the practices of "the golden rule". 

We have a long way to go. We might start here. 

[GPnative]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

And there you have it.

No single law, or pages and pages of legislation is going to solve this problem. 

We have a SOCIAL problem, more and more people feeling isolated, disenfranchised, alienated, and otherwise bitter and angry about things that even they may not be able to explain. 

Look at our history here at the RVF and note all the "Fuck you's" and hateful dialog that has become all to common. Our society lacks the "civil discourse" once mostly observed by a more tolerate population. More and more people find themselves at the margins as the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. Our institutions that we once admired and depended on are crumbling and new attitudes are replacing them that are not yet embraced by the population as a whole. 

Hugo is right. Change won't happen with new laws. Change won't be legislated from "on high". Change will come when individuals, then families, communities, and regions understand the value of rational and critical thinking, observing the practices of "the golden rule". 

We have a long way to go. We might start here. 

You are right, from now on we should end our Fuck You's with "but have a nice day"

[cletus1]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

And there you have it.

No single law, or pages and pages of legislation is going to solve this problem. 

We have a SOCIAL problem, more and more people feeling isolated, disenfranchised, alienated, and otherwise bitter and angry about things that even they may not be able to explain. 

Look at our history here at the RVF and note all the "Fuck you's" and hateful dialog that has become all to common. Our society lacks the "civil discourse" once mostly observed by a more tolerate population. More and more people find themselves at the margins as the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. Our institutions that we once admired and depended on are crumbling and new attitudes are replacing them that are not yet embraced by the population as a whole. 

Hugo is right. Change won't happen with new laws. Change won't be legislated from "on high". Change will come when individuals, then families, communities, and regions understand the value of rational and critical thinking, observing the practices of "the golden rule". 

We have a long way to go. We might start here. 

Start right here? Right now?   

[Wonky3]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

And there you have it.

No single law, or pages and pages of legislation is going to solve this problem. 

We have a SOCIAL problem, more and more people feeling isolated, disenfranchised, alienated, and otherwise bitter and angry about things that even they may not be able to explain. 

Look at our history here at the RVF and note all the "Fuck you's" and hateful dialog that has become all to common. Our society lacks the "civil discourse" once mostly observed by a more tolerate population. More and more people find themselves at the margins as the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. Our institutions that we once admired and depended on are crumbling and new attitudes are replacing them that are not yet embraced by the population as a whole. 

Hugo is right. Change won't happen with new laws. Change won't be legislated from "on high". Change will come when individuals, then families, communities, and regions understand the value of rational and critical thinking, observing the practices of "the golden rule". 

We have a long way to go. We might start here. 

You are right, from now on we should end our Fuck You's with "but have a nice day"

It would be a start. 

[Willie Krash]

The GOP is blocking attempts to let the CDC from even study the issue.
Why are federal  govt buildings and courts gun free?
Everytime this subject comes up it is always the same they want our guns. The mere thought of legislatures  talking about it results in that meme.

What people want is the adults (or lack of being) in Congress to discuss this issue and put all things on the table. Leadership is lacking here. They should be seeking solutions.

The partisan politics will assure these events will continue and the cycle will start again and doing nothing assures it will be not be fixed or at the least a moral obligation try to fix it will be ignored.

I think it was in Full Metal Jacket, as the camera looks up from a grave it pans to Animal,  he says.....better you than me.
Sums it up?

[tvguy]

How Mass Shooters Get Their Guns


Here are the origins of every gun used in the high-profile massacres of Obama’s presidency.
By Christina Cauterucci and Greta Weber


it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country.

Photo illustration by Juliana Jiménez. Photos by Andrew Burton/Getty Images and Joern Pollex/Getty Images.

On Thursday, after Chris Harper Mercer shot and killed 9 people at Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon, President Obama gave the latest in a tragic series of addresses in response to mass shootings in the U.S. "It cannot be this easy for somebody who wants to inflict harm to get his or her hands on a gun," he said.
But it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country. Of the 11 shootings that prompted Obama to give a public address, eight were committed by gunmen who’d bought at least some of their firearms legally, some just days before their massacres. Several had histories of criminal behavior and mental illness that fell just shy of prohibiting their gun purchases—and in one case, a bureaucratic slip-up in the routine FBI background check was at fault. Here’s how the guns in each attack came into the hands of t.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: Nov. 5, 2009
Perpetrator: Nidal Hasan
Guns: FN Five-seven semiautomatic pistol and Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. He killed 13 people and injured more than 30.
How he got them: Guns Galore, a gun shop in Killeen, Texas, sold Hasan the gun legally three months before the shooting. He was not required to register the firearm on the base, because he didn’t reside there.
.



Shooting: Gabrielle Giffords constituent meeting in aTucson, Arizona, parking lot
Date: Jan. 8, 2011
Perpetrator: Jared Lee Loughner
Gun: Glock 19 9 mm semiautomatic handgun. Loughner killed six people and shot 13 more, including Rep. Giffords.
How he got it: Arizona, which has some of the laxest gun laws in the country, passed a law in 2010 that allowed people to buy guns for concealed carry without a permit. Though guns cannot be sold to people with severe mental illness and though Loughner was suspended from his community college for mental health issues, no court had ever declared him mentally unfit, so his on-the-spot background check at a gun outlet came up clear.



Shooting: Movie theater in Aurora, Colorado
Date: July 20, 2012
Perpetrator: James E. Holmes
Guns: Holmes used a semiautomatic Smith & Wesson M&P15 (a variation on the military’s M16 weapons), a 12-gauge Remington 870 shotgun, and a semiautomatic .40-caliber Glock 22, killing 12 and injuring 70. TheNew York Times reports that these three guns are some of the most popular in the U.S.—so widely used, in fact, that a “three-gun competition” has been established to test gun enthusiasts’ proficiency on each in a target-shooting game of speed.
How he got them: All three guns were purchased legally in 2012 between May 22 and July 6 at three different Colorado gun stores.




Shooting: Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin
Date: Aug. 5, 2012
Perpetrator: Wade Michael Page
Gun: Like Holmes and Loughner, Page used a semiautomatic handgun. His was a Springfield 9 mm. Page killed six and injured four before killing himself.
How he got it: Page purchased the gun legally in a Milwaukee-area store. At the time of the shooting, the Brady Campaign on Gun Violence had named Wisconsin among the 10 states with the fewest gun restrictions..



Shooting: Sandy Hook Elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut
Date: Dec. 14, 2012
Perpetrator: Adam Lanza
Guns: First, Lanza shot and killed his mother with a .22-caliber Savage MK II-F bolt action rifle. At the school, Lanza used an AR-15 semiautomatic, like Holmes. Lanza killed 26 people in total and injured two before killing himself.
How he got them: Both guns belonged to Lanza’s mother.
.



Shooting: Washington Navy Yard in Washington, D.C.
Date: Sept. 16, 2013
Perpetrator: Aaron Alexis
Gun: Alexis began the attack with a Remington 870 12-gauge shotgun (he also took a 9 mm pistol from a police officer at the scene after shooting him). He killed 12 people and injured eight before killing himself.
How he got it: Two days before the massacre, Alexis bought his shotgun at a store in Northern Virginia that claims to be the “only gun shop inside the Beltway.” He initially inquired about buying a handgun, but because he was from out of state, the store would have had to ship it to a dealer in his home state. That’s when he went for the shotgun. Though he’d been arrested in 2004 after shooting out the tires of another man’s car and in 2010 after shooting his gun (accidentally, he said) through his ceiling into the apartment of his upstairs neighbor, neither charge was enough to sully his Virginia background check.
.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: April 2, 2014
Perpetrator: Ivan Lopez
Gun: .45-caliber Smith & Wesson M&P pistol. He killed three and injured 14 before killing himself.
How he got it: Lopez purchased his gun legally at the same Killeen, Texas, store that sold Hasan the gun he used in the first Fort Hood shooting. Because Lopez didn’t live on the base, he was not required to register his wea.



Shooting: Jewish community center in Overland Park, Kansas
Date: April 13, 2014
Suspect: Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.
Guns: Remington Model 870 shotgun and a handgun. Frazier allegedly killed three people.
How he got them: John Mark Reidle of Missouri allegedly bought the shotgun at a Missouri Walmart four days before the massacre, because Miller’s former felony conviction prohibited him from owning a gun. The handgun is of unknown prove.



Shooting: Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South Carolina
Date: June 18, 2015
Suspect: Dylann Roof
Gun: .45-caliber Glock. Roof killed nine people and injured one.
How he got it: A flaw in the FBI’s background check system allowed Roof to buy the handgun at a South Carolina store eight days after his 21st birthday. When the gun dealer asked the FBI for approval to sell the gun to Roof, the bureau noted that he’d recently been arrested and exercised its three-day investigation period to get more information. Two days later, an FBI agent found that Roof had not been convicted of the felony drug possession charge, so an immediate denial was not merited. She tried to contact the appropriate police department for more information, but because of a jurisdictional issue the agent couldn’t get the police report in time to make the three-day deadline. Had she gotten the report, she would have seen that Roof had admitted to drug possession, which would have kept him from obtaining the weapon.
.



Shooting: Two military centers in Chattanooga, Tennessee
Date: July 16, 2015
Perpetrator: Mohammad Youssuf Abdulazeez
Guns: According to law enforcement, when police killed Abdulazeez, he was in possession of a 12-gauge shotgun, a 9 mm handgun, and an assault weapon along the lines of an AK-47. He killed five people and injured two.
How he got them: A friend of Abdulazeez’s said the gunman had bought four firearms from an online arms sale site, which allowed him to skirt a background check, but the claim has not been confirmed. At least some of the guns were obtained legally.




Shooting: Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon
Date: Oct. 1, 2015
Perpetrator: Chris Harper Mercer
Guns: Harper Mercer brought six guns with him on his shooting spree—five handguns and a rifle—and owned eight others, including pistols, four other rifles, and a shotgun. He killed nine people and injured seven before he was killed by police.
How he got them: All were purchased legally.

I didn't look at them all but I looked at several and they all purchased their guns legally. So what's your point?

Access to guns is to damn easy. What's your point, Obama saying so?

I'll just assume you were drunk with such an ignorant response to a simple question.

[tvguy]

Write the law that would have prevented this, and publish it for us to read.

And there you have it.

No single law, or pages and pages of legislation is going to solve this problem. 

We have a SOCIAL problem, more and more people feeling isolated, disenfranchised, alienated, and otherwise bitter and angry about things that even they may not be able to explain. 

Look at our history here at the RVF and note all the "Fuck you's" and hateful dialog that has become all to common. Our society lacks the "civil discourse" once mostly observed by a more tolerate population. More and more people find themselves at the margins as the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. Our institutions that we once admired and depended on are crumbling and new attitudes are replacing them that are not yet embraced by the population as a whole. 

Hugo is right. Change won't happen with new laws. Change won't be legislated from "on high". Change will come when individuals, then families, communities, and regions understand the value of rational and critical thinking, observing the practices of "the golden rule". 

We have a long way to go. We might start here. 

Old fart alert... old fart alert


 
 Wonky....Look at our history here at the RVF and note all the "Fuck you's" and hateful dialog that has become all to common. Our society lacks the "civil discourse" once mostly observed by a more tolerate population.

Yes because some of us use swear words on this forum there are people shooting kindergartners .. OK THEN???

[tvguy]

The GOP is blocking attempts to let the CDC from even study the issue.
Why are federal  govt buildings and courts gun free?
Everytime this subject comes up it is always the same they want our guns. The mere thought of legislatures  talking about it results in that meme.

What people want is the adults (or lack of being) in Congress to discuss this issue and put all things on the table. Leadership is lacking here. They should be seeking solutions.

The partisan politics will assure these events will continue and the cycle will start again and doing nothing assures it will be not be fixed or at the least a moral obligation try to fix it will be ignored.

I think it was in Full Metal Jacket, as the camera looks up from a grave it pans to Animal,  he says.....better you than me.
Sums it up?

OK YOU tell me what congress is going to do?

Everytime this subject comes up it is always the same they want our guns.


And every time the subject comes up the president talks about countries who have gun bans. So WTF am I supposed to think?

[cletus1]

How Mass Shooters Get Their Guns


Here are the origins of every gun used in the high-profile massacres of Obama’s presidency.
By Christina Cauterucci and Greta Weber


it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country.

Photo illustration by Juliana Jiménez. Photos by Andrew Burton/Getty Images and Joern Pollex/Getty Images.

On Thursday, after Chris Harper Mercer shot and killed 9 people at Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon, President Obama gave the latest in a tragic series of addresses in response to mass shootings in the U.S. "It cannot be this easy for somebody who wants to inflict harm to get his or her hands on a gun," he said.
But it is remarkably easy to get your hands on a gun in this country. Of the 11 shootings that prompted Obama to give a public address, eight were committed by gunmen who’d bought at least some of their firearms legally, some just days before their massacres. Several had histories of criminal behavior and mental illness that fell just shy of prohibiting their gun purchases—and in one case, a bureaucratic slip-up in the routine FBI background check was at fault. Here’s how the guns in each attack came into the hands of t.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: Nov. 5, 2009
Perpetrator: Nidal Hasan
Guns: FN Five-seven semiautomatic pistol and Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. He killed 13 people and injured more than 30.
How he got them: Guns Galore, a gun shop in Killeen, Texas, sold Hasan the gun legally three months before the shooting. He was not required to register the firearm on the base, because he didn’t reside there.
.



Shooting: Gabrielle Giffords constituent meeting in aTucson, Arizona, parking lot
Date: Jan. 8, 2011
Perpetrator: Jared Lee Loughner
Gun: Glock 19 9 mm semiautomatic handgun. Loughner killed six people and shot 13 more, including Rep. Giffords.
How he got it: Arizona, which has some of the laxest gun laws in the country, passed a law in 2010 that allowed people to buy guns for concealed carry without a permit. Though guns cannot be sold to people with severe mental illness and though Loughner was suspended from his community college for mental health issues, no court had ever declared him mentally unfit, so his on-the-spot background check at a gun outlet came up clear.



Shooting: Movie theater in Aurora, Colorado
Date: July 20, 2012
Perpetrator: James E. Holmes
Guns: Holmes used a semiautomatic Smith & Wesson M&P15 (a variation on the military’s M16 weapons), a 12-gauge Remington 870 shotgun, and a semiautomatic .40-caliber Glock 22, killing 12 and injuring 70. TheNew York Times reports that these three guns are some of the most popular in the U.S.—so widely used, in fact, that a “three-gun competition” has been established to test gun enthusiasts’ proficiency on each in a target-shooting game of speed.
How he got them: All three guns were purchased legally in 2012 between May 22 and July 6 at three different Colorado gun stores.




Shooting: Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin
Date: Aug. 5, 2012
Perpetrator: Wade Michael Page
Gun: Like Holmes and Loughner, Page used a semiautomatic handgun. His was a Springfield 9 mm. Page killed six and injured four before killing himself.
How he got it: Page purchased the gun legally in a Milwaukee-area store. At the time of the shooting, the Brady Campaign on Gun Violence had named Wisconsin among the 10 states with the fewest gun restrictions..



Shooting: Sandy Hook Elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut
Date: Dec. 14, 2012
Perpetrator: Adam Lanza
Guns: First, Lanza shot and killed his mother with a .22-caliber Savage MK II-F bolt action rifle. At the school, Lanza used an AR-15 semiautomatic, like Holmes. Lanza killed 26 people in total and injured two before killing himself.
How he got them: Both guns belonged to Lanza’s mother.
.



Shooting: Washington Navy Yard in Washington, D.C.
Date: Sept. 16, 2013
Perpetrator: Aaron Alexis
Gun: Alexis began the attack with a Remington 870 12-gauge shotgun (he also took a 9 mm pistol from a police officer at the scene after shooting him). He killed 12 people and injured eight before killing himself.
How he got it: Two days before the massacre, Alexis bought his shotgun at a store in Northern Virginia that claims to be the “only gun shop inside the Beltway.” He initially inquired about buying a handgun, but because he was from out of state, the store would have had to ship it to a dealer in his home state. That’s when he went for the shotgun. Though he’d been arrested in 2004 after shooting out the tires of another man’s car and in 2010 after shooting his gun (accidentally, he said) through his ceiling into the apartment of his upstairs neighbor, neither charge was enough to sully his Virginia background check.
.



Shooting: Military base at Fort Hood, Texas
Date: April 2, 2014
Perpetrator: Ivan Lopez
Gun: .45-caliber Smith & Wesson M&P pistol. He killed three and injured 14 before killing himself.
How he got it: Lopez purchased his gun legally at the same Killeen, Texas, store that sold Hasan the gun he used in the first Fort Hood shooting. Because Lopez didn’t live on the base, he was not required to register his wea.



Shooting: Jewish community center in Overland Park, Kansas
Date: April 13, 2014
Suspect: Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.
Guns: Remington Model 870 shotgun and a handgun. Frazier allegedly killed three people.
How he got them: John Mark Reidle of Missouri allegedly bought the shotgun at a Missouri Walmart four days before the massacre, because Miller’s former felony conviction prohibited him from owning a gun. The handgun is of unknown prove.



Shooting: Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South Carolina
Date: June 18, 2015
Suspect: Dylann Roof
Gun: .45-caliber Glock. Roof killed nine people and injured one.
How he got it: A flaw in the FBI’s background check system allowed Roof to buy the handgun at a South Carolina store eight days after his 21st birthday. When the gun dealer asked the FBI for approval to sell the gun to Roof, the bureau noted that he’d recently been arrested and exercised its three-day investigation period to get more information. Two days later, an FBI agent found that Roof had not been convicted of the felony drug possession charge, so an immediate denial was not merited. She tried to contact the appropriate police department for more information, but because of a jurisdictional issue the agent couldn’t get the police report in time to make the three-day deadline. Had she gotten the report, she would have seen that Roof had admitted to drug possession, which would have kept him from obtaining the weapon.
.



Shooting: Two military centers in Chattanooga, Tennessee
Date: July 16, 2015
Perpetrator: Mohammad Youssuf Abdulazeez
Guns: According to law enforcement, when police killed Abdulazeez, he was in possession of a 12-gauge shotgun, a 9 mm handgun, and an assault weapon along the lines of an AK-47. He killed five people and injured two.
How he got them: A friend of Abdulazeez’s said the gunman had bought four firearms from an online arms sale site, which allowed him to skirt a background check, but the claim has not been confirmed. At least some of the guns were obtained legally.




Shooting: Umpqua Community College in Roseburg, Oregon
Date: Oct. 1, 2015
Perpetrator: Chris Harper Mercer
Guns: Harper Mercer brought six guns with him on his shooting spree—five handguns and a rifle—and owned eight others, including pistols, four other rifles, and a shotgun. He killed nine people and injured seven before he was killed by police.
How he got them: All were purchased legally.

I didn't look at them all but I looked at several and they all purchased their guns legally. So what's your point?

Access to guns is to damn easy. What's your point, Obama saying so?

I'll just assume you were drunk with such an ignorant response to a simple question.

No not drunk. I just meant it is very easy to get a gun in this country and do what the killers on that list did. I also think knocking Obama because he showed some frustration is stupid. I think we established that the problem is  a combination of easy access to guns and mental illness. Why criticize Obama for telling the truth?