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08-25-2012, 07:51 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 07:52 AM by GoCometsGo. Edited 1 time in total.)
If we follow along with the Larry's premise, we will begin to move away from the mentality that creates victims out of so many of our citizens. Big government loves victims to take care of. It's in the business of creating even more... thereby perpetuating the need to grow even bigger. This is the entire basis of the right vs. left split in this country. It's not that it's so wrong to teach a class in Spanish to mostly Spanish speaking kids. It's that, by doing so, we create the mindset that we OWE it to them to do so. That mindset carries forward and becomes very problematic as time goes forward.
As far as it being deplorable that so many Americans speak only one language... what is so wrong with that? It would only be deplorable if we were to move to a country that does not use English as it's main language and we refused to learn the language that they speak... but rather DEMAND that THAT country change their system to accommodate us.
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(08-25-2012, 07:51 AM)GoCometsGo Wrote: If we follow along with the Larry's premise, we will begin to move away from the mentality that creates victims out of so many of our citizens. Big government loves victims to take care of. It's in the business of creating even more... thereby perpetuating the need to grow even bigger. This is the entire basis of the right vs. left split in this country. It's not that it's so wrong to teach a class in Spanish to mostly Spanish speaking kids. It's that, by doing so, we create the mindset that we OWE it to them to do so. That mindset carries forward and becomes very problematic as time goes forward.
As far as it being deplorable that so many Americans speak only one language... what is so wrong with that? It would only be deplorable if we were to move to a country that does not use English as it's main language and we refused to learn the language that they speak... but rather DEMAND that THAT country change their system to accommodate us.
Exactly!
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08-25-2012, 08:11 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 08:20 AM by bbqboy. Edited 2 times in total.)
Were we a closed country with no outside trade or interaction, speaking only English might make sense. We already have a multi-tiered system in this country of educated and non educated.
What would kids in such a school be educated to do? What skills are to be gained by dumbing down a whole generation of teenagers?
We were being taught Spanish in grade school in 1959,now it is the work of the devil?
My niece has already used her Japananese language skills learned in HS to great advantage, traveling to and working there,and pursuing a career in animation.
She doesn't want to work in a mill in White City.
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I only speak one language, but from what I read this is not very common in an international community. To not bother at least trying to understand people from other cultures and thinking English alone is sufficient seems sort of arrogant and uncaring as a world citizen to me, and I realize I'm indicting myself as I say it too.
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08-25-2012, 08:19 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 08:19 AM by Larry. Edited 1 time in total.)
(08-25-2012, 08:11 AM)bbqboy Wrote: Were we a closed country with no outside trade or interaction, speaking only English might make sense. We already have a multi-tiered system in this country of educated and non educated.
What would kids in such a school be educated to do? What skills are to be gained by dumbing down a whole generation of teenagers?
We were being taught Spanish in grade school in 1959,now it is the work of the devil?
My niece has already used her Japananese language skills learned in HS to great advantage, traveling to and working there,and pursuing acareer in animation.
She doesn't want to work in a mill in White City.
Quote:Second, I am uninterested in whether English is your native language. My only interest in terms of language is that you leave this school speaking and writing English as fluently as possible. The English language has united America 's citizens for over 200 years, and it will unite us at this school. It is one of the indispensable reasons this country of immigrants has always come to be one country. And if you leave this school without excellent English language skills, I would be remiss in my duty to ensure that you will be prepared to successfully compete in the American job market. We will learn other languages here -- it is deplorable that most Americans only speak English --but if you want classes taught in your native language rather than in English, this is not your school.
And where in the OP did you get the idea that it would "dumb down" and not teach other languages?
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Now some of you are attributing falsehoods to the OP.
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i was responding to GCG's nonsense about teaching Spanish to Spanish speaking people. Why not respond to clete's post, or will you ignore it?
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(08-25-2012, 08:23 AM)bbqboy Wrote: i was responding to GCG's nonsense about teaching Spanish to Spanish speaking people. Why not respond to clete's post, or will you ignore it?
No you weren't. You were making false impressions about the OP.
And I will respond to Clete's post. How about I get a cup of coffee, pet my dog, make a few calls, etc., and I do that on my own timeline and not yours. OK?
Gotta run for a few. I gotta life.
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08-25-2012, 08:32 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 08:51 AM by cletus1. Edited 2 times in total.)
(08-25-2012, 07:51 AM)GoCometsGo Wrote: If we follow along with the Larry's premise, we will begin to move away from the mentality that creates victims out of so many of our citizens. Big government loves victims to take care of. It's in the business of creating even more... thereby perpetuating the need to grow even bigger. This is the entire basis of the right vs. left split in this country. It's not that it's so wrong to teach a class in Spanish to mostly Spanish speaking kids. It's that, by doing so, we create the mindset that we OWE it to them to do so. That mindset carries forward and becomes very problematic as time goes forward.
As far as it being deplorable that so many Americans speak only one language... what is so wrong with that? It would only be deplorable if we were to move to a country that does not use English as it's main language and we refused to learn the language that they speak... but rather DEMAND that THAT country change their system to accommodate us. Hi GoComets, the part of your post that I italicized above is my biggest disagreement with those on the right. It is, in my opinion, one of the myths that conservatives promote. Think about it, what would be the benefit to the so called "big government" to want its citizens poor and needing handouts? Wouldn't they want a prosperous citizenry that they can tax for government projects as opposed to having to spend money on them? I am not so much referring to our needed social programs like medicare and social security as I am welfare and help for the poor. I never understood the reasoning behind the idea that the government wants to have poor people dependent on them.
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...because wingnuts only feel good when THEY are the victims, at least in their minds.
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Personally, I find the argument that Americans should only speak one language, (as in not learning other languages like the rest of the international community) to be xenophobic and jingoistic. I think it perpetuates the view of the USA as uneducated, arrogant and ignorant of the international world at large.
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08-25-2012, 09:20 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 09:21 AM by GoCometsGo. Edited 1 time in total.)
(08-25-2012, 08:32 AM)cletus1 Wrote: (08-25-2012, 07:51 AM)GoCometsGo Wrote: If we follow along with the Larry's premise, we will begin to move away from the mentality that creates victims out of so many of our citizens. Big government loves victims to take care of. It's in the business of creating even more... thereby perpetuating the need to grow even bigger. This is the entire basis of the right vs. left split in this country. It's not that it's so wrong to teach a class in Spanish to mostly Spanish speaking kids. It's that, by doing so, we create the mindset that we OWE it to them to do so. That mindset carries forward and becomes very problematic as time goes forward.
As far as it being deplorable that so many Americans speak only one language... what is so wrong with that? It would only be deplorable if we were to move to a country that does not use English as it's main language and we refused to learn the language that they speak... but rather DEMAND that THAT country change their system to accommodate us. Hi GoComets, the part of your post that I italicized above is my biggest disagreement with those on the right. It is, in my opinion, one of the myths that conservatives promote. Think about it, what would be the benefit to the so called "big government" to want its citizens poor and needing handouts? Wouldn't they want a prosperous citizenry that they can tax for government projects as opposed to having to spend money on them? I am not so much referring to our needed social programs like medicare and social security as I am welfare and help for the poor. I never understood the reasoning behind the idea that the government wants to have poor people dependent on them.
The benefit is, and would continue to be, voters. Big government is not interested in prosperity for it's citizenry. It is interested in retaining power to further it's own agenda.
There is no way that everyone, or even most everyone, is going to be prosperous. Certainly not by government intervention. Because even if we were all doing well by today's standards... the very definition of "prosperous" would change. There will always be those that strive for more than "average." To me, that drive is what created this country and bigger government diminishes that drive. Big government uses class warfare as a means to retain power... all in the name of fairness. "He has more than you and that's not fair."
In a nutshell... the bigger the government, the more average that we become. Some people are happy with that notion. Others, not so much.
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(08-25-2012, 09:19 AM)Tiamat Wrote: Personally, I find the argument that Americans should only speak one language, (as in not learning other languages like the rest of the international community) to be xenophobic and jingoistic. I think it perpetuates the view of the USA as uneducated, arrogant and ignorant of the international world at large.
Just about have the batch of chili in the crockpot...
But to your post. Who is arguing for that?
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Go Comets at least. Why, did you have the idea you "own" a topic after it's posted, or are you OK with others adding their own opinions too?
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(08-25-2012, 09:34 AM)PonderThis Wrote: Go Comets at least. Why, did you have the idea you "own" a topic after it's posted, or are you OK with others adding their own opinions too?
I don't care who replies. How am I claiming ownership of this topic? Because I choose to only reply to certain posts?
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(08-25-2012, 09:46 AM)GoCometsGo Wrote: (08-25-2012, 09:34 AM)PonderThis Wrote: Go Comets at least. Why, did you have the idea you "own" a topic after it's posted, or are you OK with others adding their own opinions too?
I don't care who replies. How am I claiming ownership of this topic? Because I choose to only reply to certain posts?
No, because ponder is just an asshole and tv isn't on here to bash him for it. Guess it's your turn being you have had a lapse in posting.
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(08-25-2012, 09:19 AM)Tiamat Wrote: Personally, I find the argument that Americans should only speak one language, (as in not learning other languages like the rest of the international community) to be xenophobic and jingoistic. I think it perpetuates the view of the USA as uneducated, arrogant and ignorant of the international world at large.
I never saw where anyone claims that Americans should only speak one language. I feel that knowing English should be sufficient for those of us living here. I have no quarrel with anyone that wants to learn another language. That's their business.
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I just read this post by Larry. Having read Larry's previous posts, I immediately knew that he could not have written it, as there were far too many words over two syllables. It took me about 1.2 minutes to locate the original writer of the piece. It was plagiarized from a column by Dennis Prager from July, 2010. http://www.dennisprager.com/columns.aspx...7f6a0b98f8
BBQ was correct in pointing out that it really is directed to a rural, white largely male audience. It fails to recognize that America is a mosaic of cultures, and those differences when not suppressed, enrich. Those of us who have learned the advantages of cooperation, have found that we can all learn from others; respecting and learning from other's differences is what truly makes Americans unique; we are the only country on the planet that has largely been able to put aside our fears of the myths of others to build a robust and dynamic environment, that enhance the lives of all willing to participate.
The myth of the melting pot is just that; a myth; it never happened; it never was. Melting pots are for all of the stagnant countries of the world that churn out clones of a singular cultural identity with all of the myths necessary to sustain them.
Thank goodness we are all Americans.
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08-25-2012, 10:01 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 10:02 AM by Crazylace. Edited 1 time in total.)
My point is that not all Americans agree on what 'American values' are. Some want to be isolationists and some think we should think in terms of global citizenry. Some don't ever think.
And by the way, as a American Indian, Ihanktonwon, I find the idea of 'come to America and be one of us' totally offensive.
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08-25-2012, 10:05 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-25-2012, 10:07 AM by tvguy. Edited 2 times in total.)
Quote: Cletus.... Now you have done it TVguy. I have been waiting for a post like this from you. You constantly suggest that Leonard is anti American for pointing out the problems he sees that need solutions in our socioeconomic, political and and criminal justice system. Hmmmmmm
Well Cletus unlike you I don't see people like Osama ben Leon as someone simply pointing out problems.
Apparently you missed it when he said he would "back a foreign invasion of this country?" Or that this crackpot can't even blame 9-11 on the Muslim extremists who murdered our people. He even tries to tell people that was not only our fault like Ponder loves to say... but that our government was responsible  :wacko::wacko:
There is a HUGE difference in someone pointing out the problems in this great country and someone obsessively trying to make everyone else hate our country and be disgusted by every single aspect of it.
I realize you are a bit farther to the left than I am but it saddens me that you can't see this cancerous malignant hate filled sick fuck for what he is.
Sure this country has lots of problems and one of them is people like Leon who are all talk and no solution.
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