OR 7

[chuck white]

Yellowstone provides summer range for an estimated 10,000–20,000 elk (Cervus elaphus) from 6–7 herds, most of which winter at lower elevations outside the park. These herds provide visitor enjoyment as well as revenue to local economies through hunting outside the park. As Yellowstone's most abundant ungulate, elk comprise approximately 90 percent of winter wolf kills and are an important food for bears, mountain lions, and at least 12 scavenger species, including bald eagles and coyotes. Competition with elk can influence the diet, habitat selection, and demography of bighorn sheep, bison, moose, mule deer, and pronghorn. Elk browsing and nitrogen deposition can affect vegetative production, soil fertility, and plant diversity. Thus, changes in elk abundance over space and time can alter plant and animal communities in Yellowstone.

http://www.nps.gov/yell/naturescience/elk.htm

Wolves cull the weak, sick and old ungulates, that’s how they keep elk and deer herds healthy. It’s why we have predators. Wolves are opportunists and occasionally kill healthy animals but the norm is to go after the least difficult prey. What would you rather do, battle a bull elk in its prime or chase an old cow elk?

On the other hand, human hunters stalk trophy animals, the big bulls, the best of the herd. They can do this because of superior technology as in high-powered rifles with scopes. Hardly fair chase. Not even close. Wolves don’t possess guns or high-tech bows, they use their natural hunting skills they were born with. An uncanny sense of smell, legendary endurance, ground-eating speed, close cooperation with their packmates, all combined with their remarkable intelligence.

http://howlingforjustice.wordpress.com/2...doris-lin/

[cletus1]

https://www.facebook.com/SaveWesternWild...=1&fref=nf

Sad news on the elk count for the Northern Yellowstone elk herd. Any time a leftist democrat greenie tells you how much they love nature....remind them of what they've done and continue to support.

Year Elk Population
2013 2,083 with not a single calf surviving.

2012 3,915

2011 4,174

2010 4,635

2009 6,070

2008 6,279

2007 6,738

2006 6,588

2005 9,545

2004 8,335

2003-02 9,215

2001 11,969

2000 13,400 (prior to late season elk hunt)

1999 14,538 (prior to late season elk hunt)

1998 11,742

1997 no count taken

1996 no count taken

1995 16,791 (when wolf reintroduction began)

1994 19,045 (year before wolf reintroduction)

I just don't want it to happen here. But, it will. And I will be blamed.

And rightfully so.

And here we go with the leftist Democrat greenie BS again. You asked for some input from me so here it is. Wow, it looks like hunters, disease and weather played a much bigger role in the decline than wolves.

This article provides an unbiased view of the Elk decline in Yellowstone National Park:

Decline in Yellowstone elk herd leveling off
Posted: Thursday, March 7, 2013 12:15 am

LAURA LUNDQUIST, Chronicle Staff Writer

The population of the northern Yellowstone elk remains in decline, although a recent aerial count indicates the drop of the last several years may be leveling off.

On Feb. 18, the Northern Yellowstone Cooperative Wildlife Working Group counted more than 3,900 elk in Yellowstone National Park and north of the park in the Gardiner basin east to Dome Mountain.

That’s down slightly from the winter 2012 count of more than 4,100 elk. But park biologist Doug Smith said the numbers should be used as indicators rather than absolutes.

Smith conducts the park’s aerial count every year and has seen several changes over the past few decades. In 2005, when the elk count was 9,545, large herds covered open meadows. Smith said that elk are now likely staying out of the open because of wolves.

“It’s a lot harder to count elk now — they’re in smaller groups and they tend to hang out more in the trees,” Smith said. “The count is an underestimate.”

The annual elk counts have declined since 1995, when 16,791 elk roamed the area. Elk overpopulation was destroying some of the park habitat by overgrazing.

Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks encouraged hunting around the park, which rapidly brought the numbers down. FWP biologist Karen Loveless said the final big harvest was in 2005, and the following year’s count was 6,588.

Since then, the herd counts have mostly continued to drop, with some years showing bigger declines than others.

The elk tend to migrate to better wintering ground outside of the park, and this year, about three-quarters of those counted were outside the park. That’s a change from a decade ago when the split was closer to 50-50.

Smith said that proportional change was probably a product of today’s smaller herd size.

“They want to go outside the park. But when there was more of them, the wintering ground would fill up and the rest couldn’t come out,” Smith said.

A number of factors affect the herd’s growth.

Hunting played a large part until 2005. Some dwindling effects may still remain since cows can live about 20 years and a lot of cows were taken out of the picture.

Predators, including wolves, mountain lions and grizzly bears, play a part. The park’s wolf population peaked at around 100 in 2004 and brought elk numbers down. But now only 20 wolves remain in the northern range, Smith said.

The contribution from mountain lions and grizzlies is unknown, Smith said.

Finally, climate change is likely playing a part.

Prior to the wet winter of 2010, the drought probably affected calf survival. One of the largest count declines was from 6,070 in 2010 to 4,635 in 2011.

One other consideration is brucellosis. A disease surveillance area surrounds the park, where the disease exists in elk, cattle and bison and causes them to abort their calves. The disease appears to be increasing in elk in recent years.

Citizen working groups are coming together to try to reduce the interaction between elk and cattle in that area so cattle aren’t infected. With fewer elk, that job gets a little easier.

But Loveless doesn’t want elk numbers to drop any lower, so additional hunts will probably not occur in the Gardiner basin.

http://www.bozemandailychronicle.com/new...963f4.html


In the link below, the National Park Service provides information on wolf hunting near Yellowstone National Park. A lot of good information is provided in the link. Here are a few excerpts:

What is happening to wolf numbers in Yellowstone National Park?
Wolf numbers remained stable from 2009 through 2011, following a decline from earlier years. The population has declined approximately 20% in 2012 from recent years. These fluctuations are natural and primarily in response to fewer elk, their primary prey. The number of wolves in the northern portion of Yellowstone decreased from 94 in December 2007 to 34 by December 14, 2012 due to wolves killing each other, food stress, disease, and human-caused mortality inside and outside the park. Park-wide, the number of wolves in Yellowstone declined from 171 in December 2007 to 82 in December 2012 due to the same reasons. There are currently 4 packs of wolves in northern Yellowstone and 6 packs in the rest of the park that use the park for the majority of the year, but occasionally move into surrounding states.


Has the harvest of wolves in surrounding states affected the viability of wolves in Yellowstone?
No. As of late March 1 2013, 12 wolves, or about 12% of the total number that primarily live in Yellowstone, have been legally harvested outside the park. All wolf hunting and trapping units managed by the States surrounding YNP are now closed for the 2012/2013 season. The population could probably sustain higher losses per year from human-caused mortality without experiencing a significant decline. However, one NPS goal for managing biological resources is to minimize human intervention which in this case is to reduce any kind of human-caused mortality within the park. Previously, about 3-4% of the wolves that use Yellowstone and the surrounding areas were lost each year to human-caused mortality (i.e., vehicle strikes; culling of habituated individuals). Human-caused wolf mortality in trans-boundary packs at the levels seen during the 2012/2013 season is not expected to substantially influence wolf numbers in the park over the long term.

At least three of the wolves from Yellowstone that were harvested in 2012/2013 season were of high social rank (e.g., alpha female or beta male), which could affect reproduction, hunting behavior, and territory defense for the respective packs over the short term. 7 of 10 (70%) packs living primarily in the park had at least one wolf harvested from them. Thus, harvests of wolves in states surrounding Yellowstone have affected the function of packs in the park as do natural forms of mortality. Wolves often quickly fill vacant biological and social niches that are a result of wolf losses from any cause.

http://www.nps.gov/yell/naturescience/wolfhunt.htm

[chuck white]

Also the Elk populations in Yellowstone is dropping because the Elk are fleeing the up and coming erupt

[cletus1]

I wonder if TVguy still agrees with Hugo in light of the information I posted about the elk decline. It is apparent to me that the wildlife management people used hunters to purposely lower the population of elks in the Greater Yellowstone area. Also, elk cows were hunted further reducing the ability of elk to reproduce. With the decreased numbers, overgrazing has also been reduced and the balance between predator and prey brought closer to the optimum goal or so it appears.

Ever notice that some people on the RVF stop posting in topics in after information is presented that demonstrates their assertions may have been short sighted.

[Scrapper]

Ever notice that some people on the RVF stop posting in topics in after information is presented that demonstrates their assertions may have been short sighted.

Yes... or they bring up old bullsh*t and try to make other people look bad... but it just makes them look even worse (if that's even possible).

[tvguy]

Ever notice that some people on the RVF stop posting in topics in after information is presented that demonstrates their assertions may have been short sighted.

Yes... or they bring up old bullsh*t and try to make other people look bad... but it just makes them look even worse (if that's even possible).

Try? bullshit , you do look bad . Stop whining.

[tvguy]

I wonder if TVguy still agrees with Hugo in light of the information I posted about the elk decline. It is apparent to me that the wildlife management people used hunters to purposely lower the population of elks in the Greater Yellowstone area. Also, elk cows were hunted further reducing the ability of elk to reproduce. With the decreased numbers, overgrazing has also been reduced and the balance between predator and prey brought closer to the optimum goal or so it appears.

Ever notice that some people on the RVF stop posting in topics in after information is presented that demonstrates their assertions may have been short sighted.

What you posted doesn't reflect what wolves have done everywhere. It's far from some kind of proof that wolves are necessary or that they don't IN SOME PLACES kill too many elk. Or that we need them in Oregon.
I already acknowledged the benefits of Wolves in Jellystone.

[csrowan]

I wonder if TVguy still agrees with Hugo in light of the information I posted about the elk decline. It is apparent to me that the wildlife management people used hunters to purposely lower the population of elks in the Greater Yellowstone area. Also, elk cows were hunted further reducing the ability of elk to reproduce. With the decreased numbers, overgrazing has also been reduced and the balance between predator and prey brought closer to the optimum goal or so it appears.

Ever notice that some people on the RVF stop posting in topics in after information is presented that demonstrates their assertions may have been short sighted.

What you posted doesn't reflect what wolves have done everywhere. It's far from some kind of proof that wolves are necessary or that they don't IN SOME PLACES kill too many elk. Or that we need them in Oregon.
I already acknowledged the benefits of Wolves in Jellystone.

Oh, please!

Look at the reason you posted for your change of opinion. You're just digging yourself into a hole. You're arguing for the sake of arguing, justifying your position because you don't want to back down, even though your original reason for taking that position has been proven to be based on a false premise.

What's ironic here, is that just because I come from a liberal standpoint in most things, doesn't mean my opinion can't be swayed by facts, or argument. Apparently true with TV in this case also. But pin holing people only sets people against each other. My guess is that because I raised the outlawing hunter question, it is then assumed that that must be my argument, and my point, when really it was just a question.

But I have already tried to give you facts, back on page one.

http://rmefblog.blogspot.com/2014/06/inf...olves.html

Thanks. Tia THIS is why I have changed my opinion about introducing wolves is some places.

Statewide elk populations are irrelevant to impacts by wolves. When you talk about wolves, you must address areas where they live — not where they don’t. Elk numbers in the Missouri River Breaks of eastern Montana are unaffected by wolves as there are no wolves in that area; it is an apples to oranges comparison.

Since the reintroduction of wolves in the mid-1990s, the population of the Northern Yellowstone elk herd is down 80 percent from nearly 20,000 to less than 4,000 today.

[SFLiberal]

The three S's.

Shoot, Shovel, Shutup.

Works every time

[Hugo]

The three S's.

Shoot, Shovel, Shutup.

Works every time

Go right ahead. Shoot OR7. With the tracking collar, field cams, etc, the odds are very good that you WILL go to jail.

[Cuzz]

The three S's.

Shoot, Shovel, Shutup.

Works every time

Is that a threat???

[Tiamat]

The three S's.

Shoot, Shovel, Shutup.

Works every time

Is that a threat???

I think so. Yep.

[SFLiberal]

The three S's.

Shoot, Shovel, Shutup.

Works every time

Is that a threat???

Yes. If you are a Wolf or a Mt. Lion

[tvguy]

The three S's.

Shoot, Shovel, Shutup.

Works every time

Is that a threat???

No