How are YOU dealing with COVID-19? *No Politics*
#81
I'm happy to report, that I went to Safeway at lunch time, all the cashiers and workers were wearing face mask.
If winco doesn't follow suit, I'm switching. I don't care they are more out of the way.
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#82
(04-15-2020, 07:04 PM)GPnative Wrote: I haven't put any gas in a vehicle in over a month. Have hardly driven anywhere.
Me too. I did have to go get 5 gallons of diesel for my tractor.
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#83
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-14-2020, 07:20 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-14-2020, 04:53 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-13-2020, 07:57 PM)Juniper Wrote: Today I drove by a golf course and noticed people were playing golf. How is that any different from walking a trail?
 It all depends. You don't have to walk past someone on a trail and be less than 6 ft. from them.
There are bigger parking lots than trail heads have. The people running the golf course are earning a living but no one was making any money from a trail.
But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.
Think about all those golfers, each going to the same holes, reaching in and retrieving balls from the same cups...seems about the same to me.  No matter how small the trail heads, there aren't 15 people clustered around the trail head simultaneously.  You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.  And I happened to be at Lozier and W Main today, LOTS of traffic.
But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
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#84
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-14-2020, 07:20 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-14-2020, 04:53 PM)tvguy Wrote:  It all depends. You don't have to walk past someone on a trail and be less than 6 ft. from them.
There are bigger parking lots than trail heads have. The people running the golf course are earning a living but no one was making any money from a trail.
But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.
Think about all those golfers, each going to the same holes, reaching in and retrieving balls from the same cups...seems about the same to me.  No matter how small the trail heads, there aren't 15 people clustered around the trail head simultaneously.  You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.  And I happened to be at Lozier and W Main today, LOTS of traffic.
But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.
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#85
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-14-2020, 07:20 PM)Juniper Wrote: But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.
Think about all those golfers, each going to the same holes, reaching in and retrieving balls from the same cups...seems about the same to me.  No matter how small the trail heads, there aren't 15 people clustered around the trail head simultaneously.  You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.  And I happened to be at Lozier and W Main today, LOTS of traffic.
But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.
You should grab one of their motorized carts.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
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#86
(04-16-2020, 09:29 PM)Scrapper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote: But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.
You should grab one of their motorized carts.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
Yeah. But no.
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#87
My daughter and I continue to hike every day. We usually go up to Forest Park and pick a trail that we haven't been on. The last few days it has been getting very crowded in the lower parking areas so we drive further up into the park before we set out. We have been sticking to the more difficult trails but we still meet others here and there. On a typical 1-2 hour hike we'll usually meet 3 or 4 hikers. Sometimes it's not easy to step very far aside but we do our best. The poison oak is starting to come in and its getting warmer, so we will soon start looking for trails at higher elevations. We'll stop if they close the trails but it seems unlikely that they will be doing much more of that. Only very few are closed that we know of.
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#88
(04-17-2020, 08:18 AM)GCG Wrote: My daughter and I continue to hike every day. We usually go up to Forest Park and pick a trail that we haven't been on. The last few days it has been getting very crowded in the lower parking areas so we drive further up into the park before we set out. We have been sticking to the more difficult trails but we still meet others here and there. On a typical 1-2 hour hike we'll usually meet 3 or 4 hikers. Sometimes it's not easy to step very far aside but we do our best. The poison oak is starting to come in and its getting warmer, so we will soon start looking for trails at higher elevations. We'll stop if they close the trails but it seems unlikely that they will be doing much more of that. Only very few are closed that we know of.
So, where I live, the street and neighborhood I live on is a walking neighborhood.  By that I mean, people go out on constitutionals daily.  If I go hang out in my front yard, on a day like today, at least 10 people will walk by within a half an hour, walking dogs, babies, children, walking with spouses, and occasionally, just commuting somewhere.  So, over the course of a day there may be close to 100 people walking up and down my street.  Now to me, that's about the same as a BUSY trail, because usually in the course of a walk on a trail on a nice day, I wouldn't normally see 10 people.  Sometimes, but not usually.  Now, no one steps off the sidewalk when they see someone coming towards them....they just pass each other politely.  So, that's my point. We are told we can walk and exercise outdoors, even encouraged to if maintains social distancing, yet trails and ramps are closed. It's just silly.  It's literally the same thing. Yet golf is kept open. Parks are open. (I understand not using playground equipment).  So, it starts to feel rather arbitrary and indeed, like propaganda.  I certainly see a LOT more people in cars, going who knows where??  I also feel like the isolation creates a need in some people to go shopping just to go out and do something legal that feels satisfying. I feel like the crackdown on recreational places was too hasty and when things feel contrived, you start to get people who just blow it off and don't bother to try and maintain social distancing because they think it's a joke anyway.  I do notice teenagers pay no attention to social distancing at all.  I stopped at a park this week to let the dog walk around and it had been converged upon by teenagers, who were sitting together on their cars, in the sun, blasting music, smoking pot and e-cigs and generally socializing.  And other people were there also, people like me, walking their dog, or baby, or just sitting in the sunshine, so this one small park had like 50 people in it. No one was using the playground. Now that's a lot of people in one small park.
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#89
As for golf... golf courses are huge, open spaces. I think there would be no problem keeping safe distances from others. IMHO, they could stay open.

As for hiking trails... most trails are not wide enough to keep a minimum 6 ft distance when those coming and those going are passing each other. IMHO, they should be closed.

My husband is taking the dogs on a walk through our neighborhood right now. But I've only seen 2 others out doing the same this morning. Afternoons around 2 or 3 we usually see the neighbor's 3 children out playing... going on a walk, riding bikes, doing sidewalk chalk projects, etc. We just don't go out at those times.
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#90
[Image: 93705388_3069618786393295_23298310028572...e=5EC10C5E]
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#91
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-14-2020, 07:20 PM)Juniper Wrote: But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.
Think about all those golfers, each going to the same holes, reaching in and retrieving balls from the same cups...seems about the same to me.  No matter how small the trail heads, there aren't 15 people clustered around the trail head simultaneously.  You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.  And I happened to be at Lozier and W Main today, LOTS of traffic.
But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.

You know there are bound to be problems right? You haven't seen crowds at trail heads or boat ramps YOURSELF and yet you think closing them is silly? Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean there were not crowds.
We are in the midst of a world wide pandemic and all but 5 states have these kinds of orders.
Anyway like you said no I don't think it's that big of a deal that some things are closed that may not need to be. I think what is silly are the people who bitch moan and cry about their freedoms being taken away and bring up the constitution.

And even worse now the right wing is trying to blame it all on the left. Rolling Eyes
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#92
(04-17-2020, 02:30 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote: But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.

You know there are bound to be problems right? You haven't seen crowds at trail heads or boat ramps YOURSELF and yet you think closing them is silly? Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean there were not crowds.
We are in the midst of a world wide pandemic and all but 5 states have these kinds of orders.
Anyway like you said no I don't think it's that big of a deal that some things are closed that may not need to be. I think what is silly are the people who bitch moan and cry about their freedoms being taken away and bring up the constitution.

And even worse now the right wing is trying to blame it all on the left. Rolling Eyes
Well, thinking it's silly isn't exactly bitching and moaning and crying about a loss of freedoms...it's more like reflecting on it and thinking about consistencies and inconsistencies and whether or not all are effective or necessary.  That's just me thinking.  BUT there are some groups converging on the Oregon Capitol  who are doing just that. Also a group in Redmond going to the city hall...people are starting to push back, and my thinking is, the longer this goes on, the more push back there will be. [Image: EVwx1M2UMAA8Y4H?format=jpg&name=900x900] Also, I fear that as the weather grows warmer and downright hot, people are just going to ignore these kind of restrictions and converge on the lakes and rivers anyway.
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#93
(04-17-2020, 02:37 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-17-2020, 02:30 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote: That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.

You know there are bound to be problems right? You haven't seen crowds at trail heads or boat ramps YOURSELF and yet you think closing them is silly? Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean there were not crowds.
We are in the midst of a world wide pandemic and all but 5 states have these kinds of orders.
Anyway like you said no I don't think it's that big of a deal that some things are closed that may not need to be. I think what is silly are the people who bitch moan and cry about their freedoms being taken away and bring up the constitution.

And even worse now the right wing is trying to blame it all on the left. Rolling Eyes
Well, thinking it's silly isn't exactly bitching and moaning and crying about a loss of freedoms...it's more like reflecting on it and thinking about consistencies and inconsistencies and whether or not all are effective or necessary.  That's just me thinking.  BUT there are some groups converging on the Oregon Capitol  who are doing just that. [Image: EVwx1M2UMAA8Y4H?format=jpg&name=900x900] Also, I fear that as the weather grows warmer and downright hot, people are just going to ignore these kind of restrictions and converge on the lakes and rivers anyway.
Well, thinking it's silly isn't exactly bitching and moaning and crying about a loss of freedoms
I was not talking about you.You never said a word about freedoms.

I  listened to Trump the other day and his idea to open back up business in certain places. I totally agree with him.
Then after they showed him some Asian leader from some other country explaining how they did the exact same thing.
He even said that maybe when they open things back up they might have to close it down again.
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#94
(04-17-2020, 02:30 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 01:44 PM)tvguy Wrote: But it's not about making money....or is it? I haven't seen earning a living being applied to this scenario, because if it was, lots of other things could be open.

IMO it should indeed be about making money if keeping your business alive is done with people still social distancing.
Yeah the reaching in to the same hole to retrieve the ball is something I didn't think about. But how is that any different than people all using the same gas nozzles to pump their gas?
I mean other than gas being essential unlike golf.

I can't talk about hiking trails other than what I've read But shutting down hiking trails didn't cost several people their jobs like shutting down golf would do.
Now that I think about it I wonder about the likely hood of getting the virus on the back of your hand (I guess) by retrieving your own ball from the cup.
It's possible they now have people routinely cleaning anything like that people touch? IDK?

You walk along, you see someone coming, you step off the path and let them go by...less hazardous than shopping for sure.

Well that's a bad comparison considering shopping is essential.
That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.

You know there are bound to be problems right? You haven't seen crowds at trail heads or boat ramps YOURSELF and yet you think closing them is silly? Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean there were not crowds.
We are in the midst of a world wide pandemic and all but 5 states have these kinds of orders.
Anyway like you said no I don't think it's that big of a deal that some things are closed that may not need to be. I think what is silly are the people who bitch moan and cry about their freedoms being taken away and bring up the constitution.

And even worse now the right wing is trying to blame it all on the left. Rolling Eyes

Ya when climate change becomes more apparent, they'll blame the left for that too.
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#95
(04-17-2020, 03:37 PM)chuck white Wrote:
(04-17-2020, 02:30 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 09:24 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-16-2020, 05:42 PM)tvguy Wrote:
(04-15-2020, 09:02 PM)Juniper Wrote: That's true, but golfing isn't.  Ahem, Mr President.   Anyway, my point is, your chances at effective social distancing are far greater hiking a trail than other activities. It's just ridiculous to close trails in my opinion.
IDK I have not been to trail heads to see the reported crowding. Which from what I read is the issue and not just walking on a trail.
I haven't either, but I really don't think it is.  And keeping the employees going at a golf course seems minimal when so many other businesses are shuttered.  The gas thing?  It's ridiculous.  There's far less chance of spread of the virus through just attendants pumping gas than the now dozens of different people using the same nozzle now. It's just silly. I'm not saying I'm not for doing our best to get ahead of this and do what we can, but some of the rules seem very arbitrary and unnecessary.  I can't figure it out. I went to Walmart today. Well, I tried.  I tried to go in on the garden side because what I needed was near that side of the store. But they had the garden center closed.  Why?  Not the goods...THOSE were for sale on the outside of the store, all the soil and plants and what-not....it was all there for sale, just not inside.  But for me, I didn't go in, because I'm in too much pain to go in the main entrance and work myself all around and across to the far side of the store and back again. So, is being concentrated into one side of the store...it makes no sense to me.  We can go on the water ways but not use the ramps or parkways....if it made sense, I'd be more going along with it, but it doesn't make sense.  The parking lot at a trail head is much less crowded than walmarts...is it a necessity? Are we really protecting people?  No, but is it THAT big of a deal? It reminds me of food rationing in world war 2. While it was necessary in Europe, it really wasn't in the USA, but they put it into force to create the image of necessity and urgency for the war effort.  That's what this feels like.

You know there are bound to be problems right? You haven't seen crowds at trail heads or boat ramps YOURSELF and yet you think closing them is silly? Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean there were not crowds.
We are in the midst of a world wide pandemic and all but 5 states have these kinds of orders.
Anyway like you said no I don't think it's that big of a deal that some things are closed that may not need to be. I think what is silly are the people who bitch moan and cry about their freedoms being taken away and bring up the constitution.

And even worse now the right wing is trying to blame it all on the left. Rolling Eyes

Ya when climate change becomes more apparent, they'll blame the left for that too.
Most of the  far right will never blame humans.
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#96
Let them move to Florida, they can all get together for spring break, group hugs. lick each others hands. no face mask etc. Just stay away from the rest of us.
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#97
Today I went to the pharmacy. I rarely go anywhere, but there I was. I had a mask on. I turned the corner and there was a woman in the aisle. She did not have a mask. She looked at me and backed away. Very obviously backing away. It amused and disconcerted me at the same time. I mean, I'm taking precautions, but, I don't like being treated like a pariah just for being out of my home. I see no need to back away from people. Just move by and be on your way. I'm really thinking this thing...I get it and I understand, but I still have questions. Because has this virus been more virulent than any other flu we've had? Not counting New York or Los Angeles...I mean is what we are doing the reason? Or is it because it's not any worse than any other flu epidemic we've had in the past? Is it because with H1N1 the death rate in the US was 0.2 % compared to Corvid-19 ? That's still hasn't really been rated. In some areas it's as high as 3.4% but in others at .4%? What makes this pandemic so much worse than others? I'm taking precautions and following the recommendations, but I do have questions about this and how it all works.
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#98
(04-17-2020, 04:52 PM)Juniper Wrote: Today I went to the pharmacy. I rarely go anywhere, but there I was. I had a mask on.  I turned the corner and there was a woman in the aisle. She did not have a mask. She looked at me and backed away. Very obviously backing away. It amused and disconcerted me at the same time. I mean, I'm taking precautions, but, I don't like being treated like a pariah just for being out of my home.  I see no need to back away from people.  Just move by and be on your way. I'm really thinking this thing...I get it and I understand, but I still have questions.  Because has this virus been more virulent than any other flu we've had?  Not counting New York or Los Angeles...I mean is what we are doing the reason? Or is it because it's not any worse than any other flu epidemic we've had in the past? Is it because with H1N1 the death rate in the US was 0.2 % compared to Corvid-19 ?  That's still hasn't really been rated. In some areas it's as high as 3.4% but in others at .4%?    What makes this pandemic so much worse than others? I'm taking precautions and following the recommendations, but I do have questions about this and how it all works.

I would have told her, that because she didn't have a mask she needs to stand further back. I don't want you contaminating me.
And then add how rude of her not to have a mask in public.

I get more and more vocal each day this goes on.
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#99
(04-17-2020, 07:33 PM)chuck white Wrote:
(04-17-2020, 04:52 PM)Juniper Wrote: Today I went to the pharmacy. I rarely go anywhere, but there I was. I had a mask on.  I turned the corner and there was a woman in the aisle. She did not have a mask. She looked at me and backed away. Very obviously backing away. It amused and disconcerted me at the same time. I mean, I'm taking precautions, but, I don't like being treated like a pariah just for being out of my home.  I see no need to back away from people.  Just move by and be on your way. I'm really thinking this thing...I get it and I understand, but I still have questions.  Because has this virus been more virulent than any other flu we've had?  Not counting New York or Los Angeles...I mean is what we are doing the reason? Or is it because it's not any worse than any other flu epidemic we've had in the past? Is it because with H1N1 the death rate in the US was 0.2 % compared to Corvid-19 ?  That's still hasn't really been rated. In some areas it's as high as 3.4% but in others at .4%?    What makes this pandemic so much worse than others? I'm taking precautions and following the recommendations, but I do have questions about this and how it all works.

I would have told her, that because she didn't have a mask she needs to stand further back. I don't want you contaminating me.
And then add how rude of her not to have a mask in public.

I get more and more vocal each day this goes on.
Well, except she was acting like I was contaminated. It's very odd feeling.
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(04-17-2020, 07:51 PM)Juniper Wrote:
(04-17-2020, 07:33 PM)chuck white Wrote:
(04-17-2020, 04:52 PM)Juniper Wrote: Today I went to the pharmacy. I rarely go anywhere, but there I was. I had a mask on.  I turned the corner and there was a woman in the aisle. She did not have a mask. She looked at me and backed away. Very obviously backing away. It amused and disconcerted me at the same time. I mean, I'm taking precautions, but, I don't like being treated like a pariah just for being out of my home.  I see no need to back away from people.  Just move by and be on your way. I'm really thinking this thing...I get it and I understand, but I still have questions.  Because has this virus been more virulent than any other flu we've had?  Not counting New York or Los Angeles...I mean is what we are doing the reason? Or is it because it's not any worse than any other flu epidemic we've had in the past? Is it because with H1N1 the death rate in the US was 0.2 % compared to Corvid-19 ?  That's still hasn't really been rated. In some areas it's as high as 3.4% but in others at .4%?    What makes this pandemic so much worse than others? I'm taking precautions and following the recommendations, but I do have questions about this and how it all works.

I would have told her, that because she didn't have a mask she needs to stand further back. I don't want you contaminating me.
And then add how rude of her not to have a mask in public.

I get more and more vocal each day this goes on.
Well, except she was acting like I was contaminated. It's very odd feeling.

Maybe she thought you were like Chuck and was just trying to give you space.
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