What direction to take the forum in?
#61
Jesus Christ Wrote:RL Wonky has always come and go , he is much less volatile about his displeasure with posters than he was at one time. Back then there was a thing as getting " Wonked ".




Laughing Big Grin
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#62
Tia Wrote:
Jesus Christ Wrote:RL Wonky has always come and go , he is much less volatile about his displeasure with posters than he was at one time. Back then there was a thing as getting " Wonked ".




Laughing Big Grin

I think I've been WONKED a couple of times in here! Wink
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#63
imaham Wrote:I must be losing it.

Not a policy point in the bucket?

Getting us out of the middle east (I.E. a war that is sucking us dry) isn't a policy point?
Getting a speaker that can work with everyone instead of constantly using the bully pulpit to fight them?
Getting Obama to realize that he has a bunch of lame advisors that are not doing him any favors? BTW, I am not the only one that has suggested this....there has been a lot of talk about it in higher circles than the one that this forum drains into.

None of those reflect policy? Well, I might give you Pelosi but that is only because you probably deserve her! Smiling

We are fighting a war that I don't believe can even remotely be won against who? The Taliban? Osama? Does anyone really know? Oh ya...the terrists.

We need to get our legislators to work together. That goes to my point of voting appropriately. I would argue that having a large majority on either side might be seen as defeating that purpose. Perhaps we need more balance.

Obamacare? Does it not bother you how that program was forced through? Does it not bother you that a majority of our legislators admit that they didn't have a clue what was in it? Does it not bother you that our (your) enlightened Speaker said we would know what was in it once it was passed? I would submit that forcing it through just to get it done is going to be a larger problem than it was going to be to think things out thoughtfully, on both sides, and come to a consensus of what would work and what wouldn't. I predict it will not only fail but fail miserably. Perhaps reining in insurance providers and allowing across the state lines competition would have been a grand start?

Hell, Wonk. None of us have the answers. You know that. However, dismissing someone because they don't agree with ones agenda is pretty damn indignant. IMHO.

One more shot and I'm letting this thing go. Gets boring.
About the war in the Middle East: Being against it is not a "policy". Refusing to fund it would be. Since the Neo-cons and other "conservative" Republicans enacted it in the first place, well...
Being against Pelosi and the advisers in not policy: Honoring the historic tradition of the Congress and learning to compromise to get at least some of what one wants is a policy strategy.
The Health Care bill could have been very different had not the "just say no" bunch refused to engage and instead repeatedly said "we must start over from the beginning. They were dead set against defeating any health care bill. That's not a policy consideration. And the "state lines" thing was a ruse than no serious expert thought valuable. Competition in a group who have the same self interest is just plain silly.

Again, you have listed all that you have learned to be against. What does not work. Why it will fail.

You must have some thoughts about original ideas that might save us from the tragedy of two wars fought with credit cards, billions spent on drugs for Medicare and no strategy for paying for it, billions to save the banks (yes before Mr. Obama took office) who then won't release the money, and the insanity of not asking the stinking rich to pitch in a few more bucks in a time of national stress. (No pitiful crap here about "trickle down" or I'll puke on my computer screen).

You don't want answers. You want blame spread to all institutions who have any connection with government. You might look at the success of the bail-out of GM see that sometimes government intervention is critical. National health care will require some government involvement: It has in ALL industrial societies. The GOP leadership insists we have the best health care in the world. Yea...if you are a member of congress or very rich. We still have millions without ANY protection, and that will cost the society as a whole a bunch of money!

The GOP is light on ideas and strong on criticism of all things done by others. "The Market" will provide. Tell that to the millions without jobs. "The Market" works only with strong government oversight to keep the greedy from stealing us blind.

The Congress may well be captured by other than Democrats. And I'll bet the farm that not one of them will have a new idea that will be positive in making lives better in our country. They will be intent on ripping all social benefits from those who need it most.

Ham, you better get rich quick. If not, you may just suffer the consequences of your misguided understanding.
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#64
Quote:I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed person.

Well geeze Wonk. I guess we are passing each other by on this. Perhaps you should change the above to this:

I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with someone that disagrees with my position.
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#65
imaham Wrote:
Quote:I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed person.

Well geeze Wonk. I guess we are passing each other by on this. Perhaps you should change the above to this:

I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with someone that disagrees with my position.

You know hammie, my father is just a little older than wonky and sometimes he can be hard to converse with to. But it's from being almost completely deaf, not from being trained to spew the same thing over and over for too many years.
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#66
I don't fault Wonkie for his opinion ol. It just appears to me on the surface that he is exhibiting a bit of the very thing he is complaining about. We have shared a meal and a few drinks with him and I like him. I would like to think that we are friends. We don't always agree but that is usually the situation with people that don't merge lockstep.

I would go so far as to say that what we witness here on this forum is a microcosm of what goes on in government. Nobody wants to listen to the other sides opinion so we find ourselves in gridlock. To call this strictly a problem with the right, or conservatives is disingenuous at best and hypocritical at worse.
It is a perfect example of why I don't align myself with the mindset of either party anymore. I prefer to do the best that I can to think outside the box. Some times it works and sometimes I fail miserably. It is called being human.

Bottom line is that I am not going to sit by and stay silent if I feel an injustice is being done, to either side.
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#67
What you seem to be saying is Repubs have found religion and are now against the debt they created and the wars they started.
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#68
bbqboy Wrote:What you seem to be saying is Repubs have found religion and are now against the debt they created and the wars they started.

Put your crystal ball away BBQ. I said no such thing.

I am in no position to say anything about what Republicans say or do.
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#69
bbqboy Wrote:What you seem to be saying is Repubs have found religion and are now against the debt they created and the wars they started.
Your trying to ruin the board. Cool
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#70
imaham Wrote:I don't fault Wonkie for his opinion ol. It just appears to me on the surface that he is exhibiting a bit of the very thing he is complaining about. We have shared a meal and a few drinks with him and I like him. I would like to think that we are friends. We don't always agree but that is usually the situation with people that don't merge lockstep.

I would go so far as to say that what we witness here on this forum is a microcosm of what goes on in government. Nobody wants to listen to the other sides opinion so we find ourselves in gridlock. To call this strictly a problem with the right, or conservatives is disingenuous at best and hypocritical at worse.
It is a perfect example of why I don't align myself with the mindset of either party anymore. I prefer to do the best that I can to think outside the box. Some times it works and sometimes I fail miserably. It is called being human.

Bottom line is that I am not going to sit by and stay silent if I feel an injustice is being done, to either side.


Well hammie, it's like this. For a guy that claims to peruse several sources a day to gain several opinions on the issues and apply those to his views, all he comes up with is a Maddow, Olberman, leftwing tag line bumper sticker phrase. That's it, no more, ever. Guess he doesn't know of the threats of the left wing filibuster if Bush had put a stop to lenders giving loans to people that had no resources to pay them back. Guess he doesn't know that Obama cut off kids and young adults from gaining a MEANINGFUL education from a program that democrats used to segregate in the 1960s. Guess he doesn't know that under Obamacare I will have to raise my prices at least 10% just to cover the cost of the 1099 provision. Try that in this economy. The list is endless, and all he can repeat is the same tag line "republicans are bad because???" Put it on a bumper sticker wonky and maybe you can get rich to.

Well wonky, tell us what policies democrats have passed that have made the WORST inner cities in the country any better. Most are historically democrat run (into the ground). Guess you didn't get that either wonky when the leftist newsletter comes out.
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#71
Enough.
I just don't have writing skills developed enough to clearly describe my opinion that the Right Wing here are mostly reactionary rather than providing positive solutions for our many problems.

Simply put, I lose.

I'll leave it up to others to attempt a more complete and clear explanation, should they find it in their interest.

Sad
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#72
Wonky Wrote:
imaham Wrote:I must be losing it.

Oh ya...the terrists.



That would be the 'evil doers'.
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#73
orygunluvr Wrote:
imaham Wrote:I don't fault Wonkie for his opinion ol. It just appears to me on the surface that he is exhibiting a bit of the very thing he is complaining about. We have shared a meal and a few drinks with him and I like him. I would like to think that we are friends. We don't always agree but that is usually the situation with people that don't merge lockstep.

I would go so far as to say that what we witness here on this forum is a microcosm of what goes on in government. Nobody wants to listen to the other sides opinion so we find ourselves in gridlock. To call this strictly a problem with the right, or conservatives is disingenuous at best and hypocritical at worse.
It is a perfect example of why I don't align myself with the mindset of either party anymore. I prefer to do the best that I can to think outside the box. Some times it works and sometimes I fail miserably. It is called being human.

Bottom line is that I am not going to sit by and stay silent if I feel an injustice is being done, to either side.


Well hammie, it's like this. For a guy that claims to peruse several sources a day to gain several opinions on the issues and apply those to his views, all he comes up with is a Maddow, Olberman, leftwing tag line bumper sticker phrase. That's it, no more, ever. Guess he doesn't know of the threats of the left wing filibuster if Bush had put a stop to lenders giving loans to people that had no resources to pay them back. Guess he doesn't know that Obama cut off kids and young adults from gaining a MEANINGFUL education from a program that democrats used to segregate in the 1960s. Guess he doesn't know that under Obamacare I will have to raise my prices at least 10% just to cover the cost of the 1099 provision. Try that in this economy. The list is endless, and all he can repeat is the same tag line "republicans are bad because???" Put it on a bumper sticker wonky and maybe you can get rich to.

Well wonky, tell us what policies democrats have passed that have made the WORST inner cities in the country any better. Most are historically democrat run (into the ground). Guess you didn't get that either wonky when the leftist newsletter comes out.

I can't speak for Obama because I do not know well enough what he has done but I know the PRINCIPLES of the Democratic Party are good. It is a shame if someone working as a Democrat is corrupt or not following the principles and I don't know if that is the case with Obama. Kennedy was a very good President and I wish we had another one of him. Bill Clinton wasn't bad. But generally, I notice the Republican Leaders are POWERHOUSES that take big chances and RISKS. Sometimes that's good, sometimes not so good. We have to pay more attention to who we are putting in office. Try to figure out what they really are planning to do. This is not easy because MOST Presidents don't do what they have promised.
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#74
Wonky - There is no shame in trying to push through to a new day. Quite the opposite. Thanks.
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#75
I think Wonky would like to take our political conversations to a level where some reasoned opinions and ideas are discussed. What a fantastic idea. The Republicans are wrong or the democrats are wrong eventually becomes a boring game.

I would be happy to oblige except I don't have much enthusiasm to discuss politics lately. I realize that the fickle undecided voters determine the results of elections and that for the most part they are clueless zombies. I am temporarily frustrated with politics and so I have focused on other things like where to travel. Nice posts here though.
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#76
cletus1 Wrote:I think Wonky would like to take our political conversations to a level where some reasoned opinions and ideas are discussed. What a fantastic idea. The Republicans are wrong or the democrats are wrong eventually becomes a boring game.

I would be happy to oblige except I don't have much enthusiasm to discuss politics lately. I realize that the fickle undecided voters determine the results of elections and that for the most part they are clueless zombies. I am temporarily frustrated with politics and so I have focused on other things like where to travel. Nice posts here though.

I find that I see men as the ones more in fighting positions. I always thought women were more introspective. But in this forum that has not always proven to be true. I think it will be a great time when we have a woman President. But not necessarily knowing of which party. Looks like Palin might run. Not sure if she is a good candidate.
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#77
we had a fighter, Cometmom, but she sort of argued like 5th grader on the playground. Fit right in here, she did.
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#78
cletus1 Wrote:I think Wonky would like to take our political conversations to a level where some reasoned opinions and ideas are discussed. What a fantastic idea. The Republicans are wrong or the democrats are wrong eventually becomes a boring game.

I would be happy to oblige except I don't have much enthusiasm to discuss politics lately. I realize that the fickle undecided voters determine the results of elections and that for the most part they are clueless zombies. I am temporarily frustrated with politics and so I have focused on other things like where to travel. Nice posts here though.

Yes, I too am tiring of the political ranting. Including my own. Things have become so polarized that reasonable discussion is almost impossible. I admire OL, Pros, Pub, and a few others for their ability to remain on point and civil.
Damn shame. We face such important decisions that will effect lives for years.

But, I'm aware that my political life can be separate from this space. Nothing wrong with following Tia's lead and engaging in the more social parts of our lives. I like movies, books, food, travel, and jokes.

We shall see what we shall see.
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#79
bbqboy Wrote:we had a fighter, Cometmom, but she sort of argued like 5th grader on the playground. Fit right in here, she did.


There used to be another woman who matched that description also.
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#80
Wonky Wrote:[. I admire OL, Pros, Pub, and a few others for their ability to remain on point and civil.


That's a joke, right? Or did you mean Oldie?

I don't mind political talk, it seems like we used to be able to have some. But I agree, it's all so polarized and anything but civil that it gets old and depressing. When there is good discourse I usually learn something.
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